SLI

[malshade]

I'd like to build a new SLI capable system of my own but I'd really like to utilize some of my 'old' hardware. I've got a socket 478 Pentium 4 and 1GB of PC3200RAM. I did some searching around and it doesn't look like the board manf's make a SLI capable Socket 478 solution. Am I doomed to buying and entirely new set of components?

Thanks

 

[cdogg]

Yes, you must have a motherboard that has PCI-e (PCI-Express) slots and is SLI capable.

~cdogg
"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." - Albert Einstein
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[LloydSev]

Yes, must be PCI-e, with special mention of SLI.. the motherboard manufacturers are the ones who supply the card for SLI which link the two cards together.

Computer/Network Technician
CCNA

 

[malshade]

cdogg, i understand what slot type i need

lloyd, thanks

i'll ask again (but differently): Do motherboards exist that have PCI-e, SLI capabilities and socket 478 for CPU? the only SLI capable boards i'm seeing have LGA775 sockets for the CPU. unless a socket 478 processor can fit into LGA775 socket, i think i'm stuck with buying and entirely new set of components and unable to utilize my existing socket 478 CPU.

 

[paparazi]

malshade
The only parts in your list that you can re-use are the memory modules.

You will need:

An SLI capable motherboard
A new CPU to go on your chosen platform (either Athlon64 socket 939 or P4 socket 775 both with Nvidia's Nforce4 chipset)

Suitable new cooler

and a PCI-E graphics card

No manufacturer makes an SLI motherboard for your existing socket 478 P4 CPU.

By choosing to go SLI you infere you are a gamer? and so Athlon64 would be the better choice as they have been shown to outperform Intel at this and other disciplines.

As a side note* Socket 939 motherboards will also support the soon to be released dual core X2 CPU's, no so the Intel 775 which will require another motherboard type when their dual core CPU version is released.

It's looking AMD all the way at the moment.
Martin
Martin



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[cdogg]

paparazi has a good point. There's no point in ditching your current CPU just to go with a slightly faster Intel LGA775 CPU with an SLI-capable motherboard.

Intead if you really want better 3D graphics, consider the Athlon64 socket 939 route w/ PCI-e slots instead. SLI has not been proven to enhance all games, and it's not common enough for many developers to spend the $ to design games around it yet.

~cdogg
"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." - Albert Einstein
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[pmonett]

Don't forget that SLI requires a very powerful PSU. We're talking 500W here.

And have you checked the performance ratings ? Have a gander over here, where Tom's Hardware has just published a new PCI-X benchmark review.
The conclusion ? In Unreal Tournament, you get 150 to 160 fps whether you spend $200 or $1500. In Half-Life 2, SLI systems perform systematically LESS well than single cards of the same category, be it NVidia or ATI models. That's right, spending more gives you less here. In Doom III, thankfully, SLI does get a performance boost, but you'll have to really push the resolution to get something you notice - and if you do, it will just barely top the 70fps limit (only with the top-level 6800 cards).

There used to be a time where adding a second Voodoo 2 did not force you to buy a new PC (let alone a more expensive one), and it could bring performance enhancements of 60 to 85%.
Today, I feel SLI is a joke. You pay more than twice the money, and you get an average of 30% better framerates - when you don't get worse than single-card setups. I am very disappointed with SLI, I was expecting incredibly good performance and I get something that is not worth the money it costs.
Not to mention that the 7800 is going to come out soon. And you know what ? The 7800 is supposed to be named after the score it will get on 3DMark 2005. This is official, NVidia said so.
Now check out the 3DMark 2005 score for the 6800 Ultra : 5332 in the standard test. If NVidia's claims are true (remains to be seen), then the 7800 is going to perform 46.3% better - that means that one 7800 card will be able to compete with today's SLI configuration and probably get the better hand most of the time. If it's true.
But then, of course, we'll be able to argue again that the 7800 SLI is so much more powerful than the 7800 alone.
In my opinion, the current generation of cards is getting close to the limit of what we can do with today's throughput. The real change will come from the Physics Processor (PPU), that new toy that is being touted as the Next Best Thing. It just might fill the bill as well.
I think it will be more important to get a good overall configuration with a PPU, than to get a top-level SLI config without it.
Time will tell.
Meanwhile, I maintain that SLI is overrated and overpriced.

Pascal.

 

[paparazi]

Overated and overpriced! sure it is! but then isn't every piece of technology when it first comes out.
There are always going to be those that have to have the latest and greatest even though they know it's only marginally better than the previous best, at this level price is the last consideration "is it the fastest" thats all these users are concerned about even when it costs treble to get an extra 10% performance eg: OCZ platinum/Gold series memory.

The benchmarks look pretty convincing for SLI and yes until recently I had an SLI 6600GT setup and every new game I tried was SLI supported without a glitch.
Two lower end cards, although more expensive do have a better resale value than one higher end card that can loose a massive chunk of it's new retail price in a very short time.

An SLI 6800ultra is still the ultimate gaming machine.

http://graphics.tomshardware.com/graphic/20041222/vga_charts-03.html#3d_mark_2005

quote:
"SLI systems perform systematically LESS well than single cards of the same category, be it NVidia or ATI models"

ATI haven't got any SLI cards out yet! so were do you get your information from?


Martin

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Participate and help others.

 

[cdogg]

paparazi,
Actually, pmonett is right on. It only helps "some" games (not all) when running at higher resolutions and FSAA rates.

Take a look at a recent article:

http://graphics.tomshardware.com/graphic/20050524/vga_charts-02.html#3d_mark_2005

4 out of 7 benchmarks ran here indicate no benefit of have SLI over a single card. In fact, there is even a couple instances where it actually hurt performance. Now the 3DMark bench is theoretical, and perhaps some of those other game benchmarks that didn't show any improvement were coded much differently, but that is not enough reason even for an avid gamer to make the jump, just yet.

In time, SLI will likely be integrated on one board (Gigabyte has already released 3D1), instead of requiring two separate cards. And I'm sure we'll all be using it. Until "most" games start seeing benefits though, it's more of a marketing thing right now than it is to be too concerned about.

Guess it's a preference, but I'm not comfortable just yet to make the push for my clients...

~cdogg
"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." - Albert Einstein
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[ceh4702]

Then dont get an SLI Capable motherboard if you want to use an APG video card.

If you do not like my post feel free to point out your opinion or my errors.

 

[paparazi]

ceh4702
Classic!

cdogg
absolutely right! give drivers and games coders time to catch up!
I've had personal experience with several SLI setups, 6600GT's and 6800GT's as well as building several 3D1's for customers, my overall impression of SLI is positive but you are absolutely correct, results vary greatly depending on particular game and it's support for SLI.
Things are definately improving, it will take time.
I am back to a single card nowadays but that is no reflection on my own positive experiences with SLI.

I was just being objective and trying to tell both sides of the SLI story, I am neither a fan or a critic, just telling it from one who has actual experience SLI first hand.
Of course there are lots of pros and cons the decision to go with SLI is probably not a practical one but the ultimate gaming rig is still an Nforce4 SLI with two 6800ultra's, that was my point.
Martin



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[pmonett]

paparazi :

I didn't say ATI has dual card capability, I'm saying that Nvidia's SLI is often beat by single cards from both top vendors.

ATI does have something up its sleeve though, and I've been hearing about Crossfire for a few days now. Given the results in single-card setups from the X850 line, I'm quite curious to see if ATI can get Crossfire working better than SLI.

For me, SLI is a great idea with a great history (and I really do want it to work as well as it is priced), but it needs more bandwidth to really come into its own. That is not going to happen before PCI-X becomes actually useful, instead of just being the platform change it is now.

I'm quite curious to see if ATI is going to prove me wrong.

Pascal.