Setting up Mirrored Drive - Raid 1 2

[xtendscott]

I am helping a small business recover from a Server 2003 SBS crash and reinstalled the system, that had absolutly not system backups.(they have learned a lesson)

They currently have 1 IDE drive with 2 partitions (C: and D C: is where the Server OS is with Data on D:.

We want to set up a software RAID 1, but Can we with the 2 partions? I was reading on MS support pages and read something about mirroring doesn't support Partitions. Is that right? (Cant't find the page at the moment)

 

[ReddLefty]

You need a second disk. You set the disks to Dynamic Disk and then you mirror the first disk to the second. In this scenario, you can choose to mirror per partition to the other disk.

Beware that if they crashed due to a software issues, then mirroring is not the solution. Mirroring only protects one problem: Hard Drive Crash.







"In space, nobody can hear you click..."

 

[xtendscott]

Mirroring only protects one problem: Hard Drive Crash.

Understood.


So, even with the partitions, I can Change the disk to a dynamic drive. Select the first partition to mirror, select the second drive as the mirror, then do the same for the second partition.

Is this correct? Does the Second Drive need any formating/partitioning?

Thanks.

 

[tmt7734]

I would suggest getting an IDE controller with raid capabilty, it's a cheap ($60 for adaptec's 1200A model, cheaper for off-brands) addition and works much better than software raid. Also you need a backup system. I would reccomend checking out the livevault product if you don't want to deal with tapes. I'm paying $30/gig per month with 3 years retention.

http://www.livevault.com

check it out.

 

[xtendscott]

tmt7734,

I like the idea of the adaptec controller. Besides the controller setup would there have to be any system changes or would it be nearly PlugNPlay?

As I said it is a small business, and they do have an Online data Storage host for "Client data". A small inexpensive tape backup would work for a while and would probably be the best solution for providing a local system backup.

I was courious on thoughts of External USB 2.0 Harddrives. Cost for MB is very low?

 

[tmt7734]

If you went with a hardware ATA raid controller you would probably need to reintall everything on the volumes once you create the RAID array. You setup the raid array in the BIOS setup of the card, it's very simple. It might be possible to make a raid 1 array without losing data on one of the existing drives, I know it's possible with some SCSI controllers but I have never tried it with the ATA models.

USB hard drives work ok for backup, we use them to backup off site user's desktops. You can get an enclosure for less than $100 and swap IDE drives in and out of it for backups.

 

[xtendscott]

tmt7734 - Thanks for the info.

I really don't want to rebuild the system again. Anyone setup ATA controller w/ raid 1 on system without having to rebuild the system.

Might have to stay with software RAID.

 

[ricpinto]

First, do a HDD backup and test your backup.

Purchase the Following:
1. 2 x ATA HDD
2. 1 ATA Raid1 controller

Just to be safe, remove the original HDD and put aside. Now Install/configure/Build the RAID1 HDDs using the Bootable CD that come together with the RAID controller, read the manual. If everything is successful, put back the original HDD and boot to win2k install the RAID controller driver, reboot. Check: can you see the RAID1 HDD on the Disk manager, if yes leave it there, don't create any partition. Now boot to a diskette with a ghost software and do a HDD to HDD copy, you can leave or remove now the original HDD. Restart goto BIOS setup and configure boot order (SCSI is the first priority). Reboot then it should run, if not then reinstall windows 2000 server to repair the boot process. Remember, at the start of installation press F6 to load the RAID controller driver (the driver should be in a diskette, so prepare it prior to this step).

Lastly, do this at your own risk (sorry to tell you that) because what I did is fresh installation .

 

[GraqZ]

I was looking at doing the same thing, bu on a W2K Profesional system. When I looked at the Promise/Adaptec RAID ATA controllers, they both said you could mirror an existing HDD with OS. This was confirmed when I emailed adaptec. As the client never went ahead with it, I never actually tried it though. As always, I would do a ghost backup first just in case...

 

[weescotty]

If you get a RAID controller that can rebuild/reconfigure on the fly it can be done without data loss. I have done this on some of our office servers although we are using SCSI Perc3 RAID controllers.
You would have to look at the IDE RAID controller and see if it supports on the fly rebuilds without data loss.
One hint though - if you go with any kind of RAID I would NOT recommend dynamic disks. They are a lot harder to recover than basic disks.

 

[ReddLefty]

Ok, I don't usually reply to these things, but I really had to stir things up a bit

First off, quit debating on what he CAN do and instead, observe a little more of the original post:

1) Company is using SBS, which means under 50 users
2) No backup
3) No I/S - I/T, hence, that's why they called in xtendscott

What does this all mean? They do not have a very big budget. If you add a hardware mirror card (ATA-RAID-1), you need to reinstall.. since they had no backups, I doubt they have a tape backup, so they certainly can't afford 16 hours of xtendscott's time either.

You can't start adding RAID cards and start swapping drives to SCSI and on top of that all of xtendscott's time!

So, it all comes down to money, like always... so the simplest solution, is to use built-in software mirror with another disk. This eliminates on of the most common hardware fail: the hard drive.

Cost: 200$ + 2 hours

I could of suggested ANY of these solutions, but instead, I actually did the business case first, and came to the conclusion that they cannot and will not pay for such solutions. Of course, I would like to know the turn out of this, so I hope that xtendscott can give us what the final solution was.

Software mirroring will work fine if all they do is "file and print".





"In space, nobody can hear you click..."

 

[weescotty]

Agree with just about all you say Reddlefty apart from -
1) I only mentioned SCSI as an example of what we use.
2) Some RAID cards can do RAID level changes without data loss. (ours do) In fact have carried it out a few times.


In a tight money case yup software mirroring is the way to go, although I prefer to have the OS on non mirrored/raid disk and just do regular imaging. I still think the OS is going to FUBAR before the disk will. I also prefer not to use dynamic disks on any raid, just a lot harder to recover than a basic disk.

 

[ReddLefty]

All of the suggestions were good ones! But flooding posts about everything possible will lead to confusion more than benefit.

The post asked (in a nutshell): How to setup software mirroring with W2K?

Now, read the posts again and see which ones answered the question.





"In space, nobody can hear you click..."

 

[xtendscott]

ReddLefty - you pretty much summed up the situation.

The server being SBS, includes Exchange Server, SQL, but is mainly used for File serving. They are using Exchange for email, for a small number of users(6-10).

With the built in software RAID 1, isn't it necessary to make it a Dynamic Drive?

Would just adding a small tape backup alone be a better solution and just expect a longer recovery time if drive goes bad?

Would a monthly GHOST backup to the 2nd drive with additional daily data backups be a better solution?

In this situation, with budget in mind what would be some reccomendations?

All comments have been helpful in this process, Thanks.

 

[dkediger]

I would like to know the source of the crash that required a rebuild though - Windows 2000/2003 servers just don't trash themselves to the point of a rebuild.

If there's a hardware error somewhere, other than the drive itself, mirroring or any other RAID approach won't save their bacon the next time it happens.

They may think they have a limited budget - if the choice is to go software mirror or RAID controller - make sure they understand that it is limited in its protections and is only one part of an overall solution at the server level. An appropriately configured SBS server - server class hardware, RAID, tape, OS, AV - should cost $4,000 to $8,000, largely depending on storage capacity. This would get a system capable of 3+ years operation with minimal intervention required in those 3 years. Anything less is skimping and taking a gamble - period.

"The poor can only afford to buy the best.

 

[xtendscott]

dkediger - "Anything less is skimping and taking a gamble - period"

That is exactly what happend.

The short story: What not to do.
(much of this I found out after the fact, but accept some responsibility for not asking enouph questions.)
Dell WorkStation system with Xeon Processor(dual capable), origially shipped with XP. Someone helped them install SBS 2003 on D: in a Dual boot with XP on C:. A computer literate spouse of an employee "managed" the network/sever and changed IP scheem a couple times(NIC only on server) and also Netgear router(providing DHCP to server also).

I came into the situation just to help setup RAS(ok seemingly easy enouph). I had asked about backups and they said it was on a remote backup server.

Also assisting in connecting a new computer to the network, I went through the RAS/VPN configuration and opened the ports on the router. Found a Wirelss access point while at luch to try to connect and couldn't connect. Users came back from lunch and they did not have access to the server.

After a couple hours of trying to remove/reconfigure RAS to undo what was done(thinking it somehow locked up the NIC IP to incoming traffic, and calling a close associate for advice. Ended up calling MS Support.

Another 4-5hrs with support(could have been 45min if there were backups I was told), and then found out about the changing of the IP scheems, it was determined that the process of RAS configuration for the current IP "Blew Away" active directories based on prior IP's(dc, exchange, etc). It forgot that it was a Domain controller and had no contact with the network at all.

Reversing the IP to a prior scheme did allow it to partially function as a domain controller as long as the computer and user had authenticated prior to the crash.

END OF STORY

Lesson Learned: Use the change IP wizard on SBS 2003.

So no, SBS 2003 does not trash itself if properly managed.

 

[dkediger]

Feel for 'ya - cleaning up someone else's mess.

Workstation hardware, dual boot OS on the server.