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Proper name for the "at" sign
- Thread starter jrbarnett
- Start date
I've always (well for as long as I can remember) referred to this as an amphora - this symbol was used in ancient (Greek I think?) texts by wine merchants.
How can you tell if a Systems Engineer is an extrovert? - He looks at Your shoes when he talks to you.
How can you tell if a Systems Engineer is an extrovert? - He looks at Your shoes when he talks to you.
![[ponder]](/data/assets/smilies/ponder.gif "[ponder] [ponder]")
I've long held the view that it is a stylized abbreviation for "each", combining the "e" and "a" (in script) into a single symbol.
A casual look at old business ledgers finds entries like this:
[tt]
Widgets 45 @ 2.55
Things 22 @ 1.98
[/tt]
This could be read as "Widgets, 45, each 2.55" and "Things, 22, each 1.98"
Of course, it could also read just as well as "Widgets, 45 at 2.55" etc., so it could go either way.
![[blush]](/data/assets/smilies/blush.gif "[blush] [blush]")
AnotherHiggins
Technical User
Goose,
That is true of a QWERTY keyboard. I imagine you can find the @ in a different location on some keyboards without actually leaving our planet.
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[blue]-John[/blue][/tt]
[tab][red]The plural of anecdote is not data[/red]
Help us help you. Please read FAQ181-2886 before posting.
That is true of a QWERTY keyboard. I imagine you can find the @ in a different location on some keyboards without actually leaving our planet.
[tt]_____
[blue]-John[/blue][/tt]
[tab][red]The plural of anecdote is not data[/red]
Help us help you. Please read FAQ181-2886 before posting.
In France, IIRC, you need Alt Gr + 8 to obtain an '@' sign. There are indeed two different META keys on French keyboards.. 'Alt' and 'Alt Gr'. No idea what 'Gr' is.
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-- Neal Stephenson, "Cryptonomicon"
"That time in Seattle... was a nightmare. I came out of it dead broke, without a house, without anything except a girlfriend and a knowledge of UNIX."
"Well, that's something," Avi says. "Normally those two are mutually exclusive."
-- Neal Stephenson, "Cryptonomicon"
Hi,
FYI:
The ALT GR key is on the right side of the keyboard on some non-U.S. keyboard layouts. ALT GR is equivalent to the CTRL+ALT key combination, and you can use it with other keys to enter additional characters as shown in the following list of keyboard languages. Microsoft Word can differentiate between the left and right ALT keys so that you can use CTRL+ALT and ALT GR key combinations.
![[profile]](/data/assets/smilies/profile.gif "[profile] [profile]")
To Paraphrase:"The Help you get is proportional to the Help you give.."
FYI:
The ALT GR key is on the right side of the keyboard on some non-U.S. keyboard layouts. ALT GR is equivalent to the CTRL+ALT key combination, and you can use it with other keys to enter additional characters as shown in the following list of keyboard languages. Microsoft Word can differentiate between the left and right ALT keys so that you can use CTRL+ALT and ALT GR key combinations.
To Paraphrase:"The Help you get is proportional to the Help you give.."
AnotherHiggins
Technical User
I didn't know about that key, Trevoke. Apparently it means "alternate graphic".
[tt]_____
[blue]-John[/blue][/tt]
[tab][red]The plural of anecdote is not data[/red]
Help us help you. Please read FAQ181-2886 before posting.
[tt]_____
[blue]-John[/blue][/tt]
[tab][red]The plural of anecdote is not data[/red]
Help us help you. Please read FAQ181-2886 before posting.
SilentAiche
Technical User
gbaughma said:
Greg,
If you give the typing back, voluntarily, you shouldn't be @ risk of arrest. You have the right to have your )( present during questioning. I suggest you ! your innocence by #ing on the table. Absent any eye$tree, you have only your *.
Okay, I'll stop now...
Tim
[blue]_____________________________________________
"As a former farmer, I measure my produce in onces."[/blue]
AnotherHiggins
Technical User
brav-frikin'-o, Tim! That was impressive.
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[blue]-John[/blue][/tt]
[tab][red]The plural of anecdote is not data[/red]
Help us help you. Please read FAQ181-2886 before posting.
[tt]_____
[blue]-John[/blue][/tt]
[tab][red]The plural of anecdote is not data[/red]
Help us help you. Please read FAQ181-2886 before posting.
@ and " are the opposite way round depending either on which side of the pond you're on, or on the intelligence of the person who set up the computer (I always prefer it to match what's printed on the keyboard, but I'm just fussy like that).
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"Your rock is eroding wrong." -Dogbert
If an "a" with a ring around it is an "at", then let's just assume it indicates the addition of the "t" sound, so we can save some time here!
pot@o, c@, f@, womb@, taramasal@a, p@er, cl@er right?, which is a little like texting.
But if we always add a "t" to any circled letter; I'll show this using brackets like this "(a)", so then we g(e) much b(e)er (a) wr(i)ing an
ing th(a) has a l(e)er "t" in (i)!
If we draw the loop in the other direction, this could open even more compaction of our language. So a reverse loop would be and adds an "m", so c[a]era, h[a]er, tar[a]asal(a)a, ber etc.
Ive rediscovered sho(r)and!
(I)'s ok, (i) does
m(a)er, n(o) insane, I [a] a l(i)le bored (a) work and now talking sh(i).
pot@o, c@, f@, womb@, taramasal@a, p@er, cl@er right?, which is a little like texting.
But if we always add a "t" to any circled letter; I'll show this using brackets like this "(a)", so then we g(e) much b(e)er (a) wr(i)ing an
ing th(a) has a l(e)er "t" in (i)!If we draw the loop in the other direction, this could open even more compaction of our language. So a reverse loop would be and adds an "m", so c[a]era, h[a]er, tar[a]asal(a)a, ber etc.
Ive rediscovered sho(r)and!
(I)'s ok, (i) does
m(a)er, n(o) insane, I [a] a l(i)le bored (a) work and now talking sh(i).
SantaMufasa
Technical User
I have searched the Internet, unsuccessfully, to find on-line corroboration for the excellent explanation for the derivation of "@" that I received some 45 years ago.
I was visiting with an Anglophile and scholar who was also one of the few remaining skilled Pitman shorthand experts. I asked him the derivation and naming of several of our punctuation symbols that we currently use.
The credibility for his assertions derives from the alignment, some 40 years later, between his explanations and those we can find in both Wikipedia and other more scholarly resources.
His explanation for the derivation of "@" was that it was a shortcut derived from the cursive hand: If you write, in cursive, the word "at", rather than lifting your writing implement from the paper to cross the "t", writers would, following the ending downstroke of the letter "t", would complete the "crossing" with a back-handed sweep to cross the "t", ending the sweep over the "a", or even trailing down to the left of the "a" (as a flourish).
As this cursive shortcut became more accepted and recognized, further abbreviation of the writing of "at" came when the writer, upon completion of the letter "a", would omit, altogether, the upstroke and downstroke of the letter "t", but would finish with the back-handed flourish that previously encircled both letters, but now encircled just the "a", thus becoming simply, "@". The proponents of this shortcut felt that since the visual combination of the cursive "at" with the backhand flourish already possessed a readily recognisable meaning, "at", that dropping the up- and down-stroke component would still convey the meaning while being quicker and easier to write.
Because all accountants recognised this shortcut, the simpler "@" became the accepted norm to represent "at", for example, "<some quantity> @ <some price>".
The name for this symbol simply became the word it represented, "at". Later, editors and lexicographers appended the word "sign" to distinguish aurally between the word "at" and the symbol that had, by then, become an accepted short-cut representation for the word.
As we have seen, particulary in the previous links in this thread, many other languages/cultures/countries have assigned names to this "@" symbol that are unnecessarily, yet euphemistically, "lexicomorphic" (i.e. creating a name that looks like the physical appearance) such as:
"monkey's tail" (South Africa)
"crazy eye" (Balkans)
"pickled herring" (Czech Republic)
"elephant's trunk" (Denmark/Sweden)
"pig's tail" (Denmark/Norway)
"swinging monkey" (Netherlands)
"snail" (France)
"hanging monkey" (Germany)
"little duck" (Greece)
"strudel" (Israel)
"maggot" (Hungary)
"little mouse" (China)
"little cat" (Poland)
"little dog" (Russia)
"wiggling worm-like character" (Thailand)
"ear" (Turkey)
All of these endearing nicknames are departures from the original purpose/derivation of the symbol and certainly are no more succinct than the original term "at" or "at-sign".
Cheers,
![[santa]](/data/assets/smilies/santa.gif "[santa] [santa]")
Mufasa
(aka Dave of Sandy, Utah, USA)
[I can provide you with low-cost, remote Database Administration services: see our website and contact me via www.dasages.com]
I was visiting with an Anglophile and scholar who was also one of the few remaining skilled Pitman shorthand experts. I asked him the derivation and naming of several of our punctuation symbols that we currently use.
The credibility for his assertions derives from the alignment, some 40 years later, between his explanations and those we can find in both Wikipedia and other more scholarly resources.
His explanation for the derivation of "@" was that it was a shortcut derived from the cursive hand: If you write, in cursive, the word "at", rather than lifting your writing implement from the paper to cross the "t", writers would, following the ending downstroke of the letter "t", would complete the "crossing" with a back-handed sweep to cross the "t", ending the sweep over the "a", or even trailing down to the left of the "a" (as a flourish).
As this cursive shortcut became more accepted and recognized, further abbreviation of the writing of "at" came when the writer, upon completion of the letter "a", would omit, altogether, the upstroke and downstroke of the letter "t", but would finish with the back-handed flourish that previously encircled both letters, but now encircled just the "a", thus becoming simply, "@". The proponents of this shortcut felt that since the visual combination of the cursive "at" with the backhand flourish already possessed a readily recognisable meaning, "at", that dropping the up- and down-stroke component would still convey the meaning while being quicker and easier to write.
Because all accountants recognised this shortcut, the simpler "@" became the accepted norm to represent "at", for example, "<some quantity> @ <some price>".
The name for this symbol simply became the word it represented, "at". Later, editors and lexicographers appended the word "sign" to distinguish aurally between the word "at" and the symbol that had, by then, become an accepted short-cut representation for the word.
As we have seen, particulary in the previous links in this thread, many other languages/cultures/countries have assigned names to this "@" symbol that are unnecessarily, yet euphemistically, "lexicomorphic" (i.e. creating a name that looks like the physical appearance) such as:
"monkey's tail" (South Africa)
"crazy eye" (Balkans)
"pickled herring" (Czech Republic)
"elephant's trunk" (Denmark/Sweden)
"pig's tail" (Denmark/Norway)
"swinging monkey" (Netherlands)
"snail" (France)
"hanging monkey" (Germany)
"little duck" (Greece)
"strudel" (Israel)
"maggot" (Hungary)
"little mouse" (China)
"little cat" (Poland)
"little dog" (Russia)
"wiggling worm-like character" (Thailand)
"ear" (Turkey)
All of these endearing nicknames are departures from the original purpose/derivation of the symbol and certainly are no more succinct than the original term "at" or "at-sign".
Cheers,
Mufasa(aka Dave of Sandy, Utah, USA)
[I can provide you with low-cost, remote Database Administration services: see our website and contact me via www.dasages.com]
![[wink]](/data/assets/smilies/wink.gif "[wink] [wink]")
d[a] th(a)s good!
I realise that they arent loops or reverse loops but...
if {x} was xe (a half {r}{v}r{s} loop?)
wh(a) would the following {b} {b}st used as
<x>
If (i) could ha{v} go{n} wrong earl{i}r and (i) did, (i) u(l){(a)}ly would ha{v} {{b}}n {b}{n}ficial for (i) to ha{v}." : Murphy's U(l){(a)} Corollary
I realise that they arent loops or reverse loops but...
if {x} was xe (a half {r}{v}r{s} loop?)
wh(a) would the following {b} {b}st used as
<x>
If (i) could ha{v} go{n} wrong earl{i}r and (i) did
, (i) u(l){(a)}ly would ha{v} {{b}}n {b}{n}ficial for (i) to ha{v}." : Murphy's U(l){(a)} Corollary- Status
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