Pricing 1

[snowboardr]

For those have you who have gone through a few projects, what have you found to be the best pricing technique for a website that is medium in size and dynamic in asp / mysql.

- Jason

www.vzio.com
ASP WEB DEVELOPMENT

 

[RISTMO]

Search this forum...I think all of us in here are sick of posting the same thing over and over again ;-).

Rick
P.S. This is probably the most frequently asked question for this forum.

-----------------------------------------------------------

http://www.ristmo.com/

RISTMO Designs

http://www.arabchurch.com/

Arab Church

http://www.reference-guides.com/

Reference Guides

 

[cian]

Keep getting an internal server error when I visit your site Jason. You'd want to check that one out fairly lively.

Rick, new site? Reference Guides
Good work!





- É -

http://www.ssi-developer.net

 

[RISTMO]

Hey Cian,

Yep, it's a new site, but unfortunately, it's not mine. I'm advertising it for a friend. You can be sure that when I have a new site, I'll post it here for the whole world to see ;-). I'm working on 7 right now...hopefully one will be done fairly soon....

Thanks for the comments! I'll be sure to pass them on...

Rick

-----------------------------------------------------------

http://www.ristmo.com/

RISTMO Designs

http://www.arabchurch.com/

Arab Church

http://www.reference-guides.com/

Reference Guides

 

[Gatorajc]

You will never get an answer that suits you. Depends on experience, part of the country, etc, etc, etc.

I can only give the best advice I read from someone in another post and it has worked for me.

Charge whatever it would take to live on. For example take your expenses, spending cash, whatever you spend on your lifestyle in a month. Break it down into an hourly rate.

If your doing it part time charge half of that.

This way you can justify to yourself the time you put in.

As you get more jobs adjust this up if you want. If you have to adjust it down change your lifestyle or find something else.



AJ


If at first you do not succeed, cheat!

 

[cian]

Although many will say an hourly rate is unprofessional. You could work out your hourly rate, estimate the time it will take for a project and quote a project rate to the client. More professional that way.

The best technique is one which works for you. ;-)




- É -

http://www.ssi-developer.net

 

[TheConeHead]

Actually an hourly rate is a more professional way to go, IMHO. Nothing lookis more amatuer than seeing:

Bronze Package: 3 pages, 3 images $250
Silver Package: 5 pages, 5 images $350
Gold Package: 7 pages, 7 images $450

There is no way that a professional would charge the same for a simple little button and a photographic intense montage say 300x300 the best way to do it is to say:

Graphic Design: $75/hr

This button will take me 15 minutes, that will cost you $18.75. That montage will take me 3 hours, that will cost you $225. You can not quote a fair and respectable price unless you have the customer requirements. A static html page should not cost as much as a dynamic db driven page.

just my thoughts...

 

[cian]

I agree and disagree...

1. I also think see prices for packages is unprofessional.
BUT
2. I think it's best to give a project cost but it MUST be tailored for each individual project which can only be done after reviewing the clients requirements.

I would be very hesitant to quote general prices, but perhaps only as a guideline such as what you have posted.

>Graphic Design: $75/hr

IF I was a professional designer i'd do it something like:

1. Each project would be quoted to the customer as a project price with a cost breakdown if required/requested.

2. The website would contain cost guidelines/estimates:
HTML coding: $$/hr
Database coding: $$/hr
Graphic design: $$/hr
etc
...which would be use in the creation of a project cost for the client.

Of course you could hire yourself by the hour, but I think this cost should be higher than as a project cost.




- É -

http://www.ssi-developer.net

 

[TheConeHead]

Can;t disagree with that.... The only thing you have to watch out for is you better be able to justify your price. Like you say, have it based on something (like an hourly charge) You can not say, "Well, it looks like this is 50 hours of work and I charge $85/hour and that works out to $4250 but I think this is a $7k job so I'll charge that" You will be screwed if they want to see your justification. Your price must be based on something. Current market rates and such - not just taken from the air or even what your lifestyle justifies... people are not paying for your standard of living, they are paying for a product...

 

[cian]

Oh yeah, totally agree, it MUST be based on something, but I would be hesitant about quoting that something as your standard charges on a website, I would only use it as a guideline if you MUST post something on your site (and to back-up your project bill when your client starts moaning)




- É -

http://www.ssi-developer.net

 

[Wullie]

Actually an hourly rate is a more professional way to go IMHO

It all depends who you ae dealing with, most companies will prefer a full costing before the work starts.

When you use hourly rates, you will normally be asked to provide an estimate of total hours it will take. If you go well over this estmate then you look totally unprofessional, so in a lot of ways you are better to quote a fixed price based on your judgement of the project.

Nothing looks more amatuer than seeing:

Bronze Package: 3 pages, 3 images $250
Silver Package: 5 pages, 5 images $350
Gold Package: 7 pages, 7 images $450

This is where terms and conditions come in to play. If you offer packages and don't have clear and consise terms and conditions then it's suicide. Having clear terms and coditions means that you can provide details of exactly what is and what is not covered.

I use packages for promotions, and I get a lot of interest about these. I have very clear terms and conditions and this benefits me and the client, because both of us know where we stand.

Putting a price of £50/hour on a website means nothing to a lot of people, the first thing they will think is "How many hours will it take?" Most sits make it even worse by saying "An average website would take 20 hours." hmmm, ok, and what is an average website?

Putting a package with a fixed price means they can look and see if the package would suit them, if so then they know the exact price involved.

Pricing depends on the following to name a few:

Experience
Speed of working
How in demand you are?
Expenses involved
Business or pleasure?
Time involved

One thing that really annoys me personally is when I am outsourcing work and I get a list of prices such as:

Database work: £40/hour
HTML: £20/hour
Perl, PHP, CF: £40/hour
Graphic Design £30/hour

Either their time is worth £20/hour or £40/hour, it can't be both.

Hope this helps

Wullie

http://www.necomputers.org.uk

http://www.freshlookdesign.co.uk

http://www.freshlookdesign.com

http://www.whiland.co.uk

The pessimist complains about the wind. The optimist expects it to change.
The leader adjusts the sails. - John Maxwell

 

[onpnt]

Hi wullie,
On
Either their time is worth £20/hour or £40/hour, it can't be both.

How can you reference a set hourly rate for technologies that take a completely difference precedence. I mean that would be like stating writing HTML tag based code is as simplified as writing a php MySQL database interface to collect interactive data. Can those two situations be set to one rate?

I completely disagree with that
--or did I take that the wrong way--



____________________________________________________

http://www.onpntwebdesigns.com

 

[Gatorajc]

Without getting into a economics principles discussion, people would be paying for his standard of living and not just a product.

If he ends up getting paid $6 an hour for a project is it really worth it to him, if that is what the market rate is. Maybe if you are mass producing the project.


AJ


If at first you do not succeed, cheat!

 

[Wullie]

Hi Ted,

I'm not saying that these technologies are not different, but the more complex the job, the more hours it will take you.

If you have to write HTML for 10 hours or write a backend admin panel for a site with PHP + MySQL for 10 hours, both take the same time to do.

Why should you charge more for 1 than the other? If you value your work at £40/hour, how can you live if you only get HTML work for a week?



Wullie

http://www.necomputers.org.uk

http://www.freshlookdesign.co.uk

http://www.freshlookdesign.com

http://www.whiland.co.uk

The pessimist complains about the wind. The optimist expects it to change.
The leader adjusts the sails. - John Maxwell

 

[onpnt]

good point! I like the way you phrased that much better. Now I have to re-think the current way I compare my pricing. da^* it.


____________________________________________________

http://www.onpntwebdesigns.com

 

[Wullie]

Hi mate,

I knew you would see it my way.

Most business sectors that charge different hourly rates do it because there are different materials costs involved with each rate.

If you want a good pricing structure for projects, create it so that the longer the project, the less the hourly rate.

In the end, you get more money for longer projects, but still get the same amount you normally would for shorter ones.

Something like:

Under 10 Hours: £50/hour
10 - 20 Hours: £45/hour
Over 20 Hours: £40/hour

Obviously, these are off the top of my head.

Bulk pricing works in any line of business, you are tempting people that want 8 hours work into adding something else as it works out cheaper in the long run. You are also making your prices very competitive for long and short projects.

Hope this helps

Wullie

http://www.necomputers.org.uk

http://www.freshlookdesign.co.uk

http://www.freshlookdesign.com

http://www.whiland.co.uk

The pessimist complains about the wind. The optimist expects it to change.
The leader adjusts the sails. - John Maxwell

 

[onpnt]

I currently do lower my rates per given time concerns.
example would be a cart I added to a site recently all client level scripting. If I were to have charged a hourly rate of the stated $35 or so at 500+ pages and 6-8 items a page, they would have gone bankrupt

so I then reduced it to $1.50 a item and the scripting was no charge.

just a example of how you can determine how to structure different tasks

____________________________________________________

http://www.onpntwebdesigns.com

 

[TheConeHead]

I totally disagree... the hourly rate I charge to make a static HTML page and the hourly rate I charge to render a 3D image a very different and that is for the same reason that a Miata costs less than a BMW... These are very different technology's that require different levels of skill... such is the case with a static HTML page and a db driven page - these should not cost the same... how quickly I can do it has nothing to do with the cost of the service I am providing...

 

[Wullie]

Miata costs less than a BMW

As I said, there are different materials involved in this situation, your time is a constant, not a variable.

Also, as well as different materials, you have different people, different skills. It's not the exact same people making both machines, is it?

If you charge different amounts for your time when there are no additional costs involved to you for providing the service, you are changing the value of your work.

Your work should be valued at what it means to you, so an hours work is an hours work, no matter whether it is spent coding PHP or HTML.

Hope this helps

Wullie

http://www.necomputers.org.uk

http://www.freshlookdesign.co.uk

http://www.freshlookdesign.com

http://www.whiland.co.uk

The pessimist complains about the wind. The optimist expects it to change.
The leader adjusts the sails. - John Maxwell

 

[TheConeHead]

I guess we will just have to agree to disagree:

Ten thousand and one high school boys named Chip can code an html page - should not be an expensive charge no matter how long it takes

Using Lightwave 3d to model an object, importing it into Maya for texturing and surfacing, importing that into Adobe Premiere to provide animatics is a more refined skill and should cost more... Which is why a 3D animator gets paid more than a straight htmler... using your theory they should be paid the same... should someone whose job is to do straight html be paid the same as someone who utilizes oracles dbs, java and such in a web site? of course not...

The issue is not time but what you are doing in that time... most likely someone who charges the same rate for any type of work will greatly overcharge for work that should be charged at a lower rate...

Hope this helps