A fun paragraph 1

[Thadeus]

This is from the folks at Political Compass.

When are you guys gonna learn to spell ?
This grievance comes from those who aren't aware that British and American spellings sometimes differ.

We've been at the centre of some rancour, but we're not going to take offence or harbour any grievances. The catalogue of complaints won't colour this organisation's programme. It's a grey area anyway. And we don't want to labour the point.

~Thadeus

 

[earthandfire]

I wholeheartedly agree

 

[GwydionM]

Gaol is the best place for those who blandly assume their own way must be right.

On a related matter,

We drive on the right-hand side of the road because it is easier to have a rule that everyone follows...

James Surowiecki's much-praised The Wisdom Of Crowds has some interesting points, but is seriously parochial. He fails to realise how much of his own norm is not normal elsewhere.



------------------------------
An old man who lives in the UK

 

[SantaMufasa]

It is, of course, not only spelling, but everyone knows (as George Bernard Shaw observed) that Brits and Yanks are "...One people, separated by a common language".

You can imagine what trouble I inadvertently caused in Birmingham, England when I walked into the Burton's Clothiers shop and asked the saleslady if she could please show me her pants and suspenders...

Wow, you would have thought I had just propositioned her...which, in fact, I nearly had. My buddy (read: "Mate" in the UK) quickly yanked me outside (no pun intended) and explained to me that I had just asked her to show me her garters and panties. Instead, I should have asked to see her "trousers and braces".

Not long afterward, someone asked me what I did for a living back in America. I said that I was attending university (read: "College" in the US), but that I worked part time on Ski Patrol. They said that they had always wanted to take up skiing, but that it was so expensive, especially the skiis and the clothing. I said, "The clothing isn't that expensive...I just ski in a parka and knickers."

I couldn't understand why they were rolling on the floor in uproarious laughter until someone explained the picture in their heads of my shussing down the slopes in a jacket and very brief women's panties!

And there are so many other terms:

bonnet = hood
mud guard = fender
boot = trunk
windscreen = windshield
tyre = tire
lorry = truck
articulated lorry = semi-truck/trailer
plaster = band-aid
cheeky = rude
on holiday = on vacation
poorly = ill
Mum = Mom
nappy = diaper
serviette = napkin
tea = dinner
dinner = lunch
rubber = eraser
knocked-up = awakened
preggers = knocked up
tummies = tomatoes
chips = french fries
crisps = potato chips
biscuit = cookie
takeaway (food) = takeout (food); to-go
jam = jelly
jelly = jell-o/gelatin
bang on = right on
works a treat = does well
straight away = right now
a belter = exciting
valve = vacuum tube
tube = subway
subway = underground walkway
"Mind the gap" = "Watch your step"
"That's not cricket" = "That's not fair"
nosh = eat
natter = visit
petrol = gasoline
bangers = sausages
hoover = vacuum
lift = elevator
dummy = pacifier
loo = bathroom
quid = buck
football = soccer
American football = football
Australian-rules football = mayhem

Then there are a variety of British profanities that either have no particular American meaning or the American meaning is waaaaay different from the British meaning:
wanker, sod off, bum, fanny, bloody, and many more, but I'll now need to go to confession just for mentioning these.

Plus gestures can differ: be careful in England how you flash someone the "V"-for-Victory sign.

Mufasa
(aka Dave of Sandy, Utah, USA)

http://www.dasages.com

Do you use Oracle and live or work in Utah, USA?
Then click here to join Utah Oracle Users Group on Tek-Tips.

 

[earthandfire]

What annoys me most, though are the different definintions of English. English is English. Other variants are American English, Australian English et al. But there should be no need to specify "British" English. As I said, English is English, and accordingly is spelled and has the meanings as they are understood in England.

 

[sha76]

Where abouts in England do they call tomatoes "tummies"?

Also, I don't know if this is just me not properly understanding the American meanings (quite possible!), but I'd disagree with a few translations:
"Mind the gap" - used specificaly when there is a gap eg between a train & platform, not so general as "Watch your step"
"Natter" - to have a good chat
"cheeky" - well, yes, it is rude, but again it's more specific, it's unlikely to be offensive

"Your rock is eroding wrong." -Dogbert

 

[KenCunningham]

earthandfire, you seem to make the common mistake of equating 'British' with 'English'. I say this as one of the latter exiled to one of the constituent parts of the former's Isles. I am often amazed by the variety and inventiveness of 'English' as she is spoken even within these Isles, never mind the rest of the world. Another to add to Dave's list tap = faucet.

 

[LFCfan]

Further to Sha76's reply:
quid = pound, not buck!

 

[earthandfire]

KenCunningham, my point is that these days the unqualified word English as it refers to the language is now taken to mean the American variety. To specify the language as spoken in the UK (or at least as it is shown for example in OED) it is necessary to say British English. This I think is wrong. There is no British English. There is English, American English, Australian English etc. The variant as used in the UK should not be qualified, all other variants should or perhaps, more appropriately given their own names.

 

[tsdragon]

I think the synonym sha76 is looking for for the word "cheeky" might be "sassy", but even that's not quite right.

Tracy Dryden

Meddle not in the affairs of dragons,
For you are crunchy, and good with mustard.

 

[SantaMufasa]

Good point from all comers. In mild response, however:

sha76 -- tummies: actually, I hadn't heard that one either, but had to take the journalistic word of Don Ramon in paragrap 7, sentence 2 of his e-column at

http://www.donramon.net/articles/articles_level2_023.htm.

Perhaps, as with many terms in Britain, it may be a regional term, like a woman calling her friend "Duck" (or "me duckie") or a guy referring to another guy by the term "Cock". [You should have seen the look on my face the first time I nodded to a stranger on the street in the Pottries and he responded with, "Alright, Cock?". I didn't know if I was supposed to punch him out or what.]

"Mind the gap": Obviously a term from the London Underground, and it's one of our families favourite sayings from our days there. Not that one would use it anywhere besides the Underground, but here in the US, under similar circumstances, the electronic voice would say, "Watch your step." In any case, point well taken, sha.

Natter: Must be a Midlands term...heard it frequently there. After a visit, people would say, "We had a good natter."

Cheeky: You're right...I doesn't really mean "rude" in a negative sense. It's usually used in a playful, teasing sense as when someone may have just made a slightly naughty (pronounced: "no-ty") comment, a proper lady might feign offence by saying, "Cheeky devil." Right, sha? Perhaps a better American translation is, in fact, "playfully naughty".

LFCfan: You, too, are correct..."quid" != "buck". I should have originally suggested:
"quid (one unit of local [English] currency) ~ buck (one unit of local [US] currency)"

earthandfire: I agree with you...Americans do not speak English. Perhaps we can suggest new names for what we colonists speak:

"American-ish"
"USage"
"Yank-ish"
"Uh-mur-cun"

Any other suggestions?

Oh, and I accidentally omitted some important terminological differences on my earlier list:

Bird = Chick (female variety)
Bloke = Guy
Guy = The chap who tried to burn down Parliament




Mufasa
(aka Dave of Sandy, Utah, USA)

http://www.dasages.com

Do you use Oracle and live or work in Utah, USA?
Then click here to join Utah Oracle Users Group on Tek-Tips.

 

[columb]

The cock word caused my family some confusion. My father was on a year's sabbatical in 1959/1960 and we all moved over from the UK to live in New Jersey. I was six at the time and when I started school the teacher asked me to describe a farmyard. I named the male equivalent of a hen as a cock. You can imagine the teacher's horror at such fowl (sorry couldn't resist the pun) language coming from a six year old. When she phoned my mother it took some time to sort out that I hadn't been rude, just English.

On a more general note we Brits tend to understand US English better than the US understands ours. This is a by-product of the all pervading power of Hollywood. When I went back to the states in the eighties it was 'just like the movies' and I had little difficulty with the language or customs.

Columb Healy

 

[AnotherHiggins]

I'm reminded of the story a close friend tells involving a young English boy he went to Elementary school with. My friend's father took both boys shopping for supplies at the beginning of the school year. My friend and his father were on one aisle, the young Brit on the next aisle.

The Brit yells across to my friend, "Where are the rubbers?"

My friend's father nearly fainted. Imagine a 7-year-old boy yelling across the store inquiring as the whereabouts of condoms.

In England a rubber is what we Americans call an eraser.

This looks like a pretty good list of British-to-North American translations.

[tt]_____
[blue]-John[/blue]
[/tt][red]"If you're flammable and have legs, you are never blocking a fire exit."[/red]
-Mitch Hedberg

Help us help you. Please read FAQ181-2886 before posting.

 

[SantaMufasa]

Yes, Columb, I believe you are correct about Brits understanding Yankish better than Yanks understanding "British". In additional to the "Hollywood Factor", however, I believe at least part of our "obliviance" to the rest of the (English-speaking and non-English-speaking) world comes from our native arrogance.

As an example of how early it can start, my brother and sister-in-law had an assignment to teach at an American-run technical school named "Bien Merito" in Mexico City. The students were all Spanish-speaking Mexicans.

One day, my two 5-year-old twin nephews received "G.I. Joe" action figures for their birthday there in Mexico. They were so excited to share their joy over the gifts that they ran outside and (in English) started telling the confused Mexican passers-by about their toys. When one of the boys noticed that they weren't "getting through", he stopped and asked his audience, "Hey, where you fwom anyway?"

See, it's our (American) expectation that the rest of the world will speak on our terms, and if they don't then the other (foreign) guys must be either illiterates or idiots.

If my American colleagues disagree, let's just take a simple test: compare the percentage of Americans that are multi-lingual to the percentage of multi-linguals in the non-American industrialised world. I believe British multilinguals far exceed American multilinguals per capita, as well.

Another test: What percentage of American high school students must study Japanese to graduate: 0%. What percentage of Japanese high school students must study English to graduate: 100%.

Sad state of affairs (IMHO).

Mufasa
(aka Dave of Sandy, Utah, USA)

http://www.dasages.com

Do you use Oracle and live or work in Utah, USA?
Then click here to join Utah Oracle Users Group on Tek-Tips.

 

[Stella740pl]

If my American colleagues disagree, let's just take a simple test: compare the percentage of Americans that are multi-lingual to the percentage of multi-linguals in the non-American industrialised world. I believe British multilinguals far exceed American multilinguals per capita, as well.

Will we count all the naturalized immigrants, too, or just natively born Americans? Because a lot of Americans around are multilingual, and some of them were even born here.


Another test: What percentage of American high school students must study Japanese to graduate: 0%. What percentage of Japanese high school students must study English to graduate: 100%.

Japanese? Why Japanese? 100% of American high school students must study language other than English to graduate - wouldn't call it exactly a 'foreign' language.
Japanese study English as a foreign language because it's one of the most spoken languages in the world and currently the language of international business.

 

[GwydionM]

Regarding 'rubbers'; contraceptive sheeths in Britain are best known by a manufacturer's name, Durex. In Australia the name gets applied to another of their products, sticky tape. Leading to unfortunate misunderstaindings when visiting Australians ask for 'a roll of Durex'.

------------------------------
An old man who lives in the UK

 

[CrystalStart]

SantaMufasa;
I am always getting 'off' when I hear this:
...it's our (American) expectation that the rest of the world will speak on our terms...

Is it hard to understand that as large as USA is it is only fare for others to adopt language of majority (if desired) then English speaking population to learn every possible language to communicate?

...and if they don't then the other (foreign) guys must be either illiterates or idiots...

Wrong again! My mother while learning to built sentences English way said 'it is stupid way to speak' and it took me time to convince her that 'these people do not know it is stupid, so you will have to put up'
So, please, do NOT generalize based on 'those Americans, those Brits' and such, it is indication of lower intelligency to me when people say 'all Americans are...'

Another test: What percentage of American high school students must study Japanese to graduate: 0%. What percentage of Japanese high school students must study English to graduate: 100%.
WHY Japanese? How many Japanese people will you meet in your life to talk with?
There are also Armenian and Eskimo languages...
I am back to my soapbox...

 

[columb]

I would love to think of we Brits as polylingual but....

I was in France a couple of years back having a great holiday in Brittany. I got chatting in French to one of the local shopkeepers. My appology for my poor 'O' level (Year 11 in the US?) French was brushed aside. The shopkeeper explained that there were many Brits who had lived in the village permenantly for ten years or more and still didn't speak French. In the light of this my efforts were appreciated.

I would have found this hard to believe if it were not for a co-worker who has purchased a holiday home in southern France. He will be visiting at least once a year and still doesn't see any need to learn French 'After all British is the international language.'

Sometimes I dispair!

Columb Healy

 

[SantaMufasa]

Stella, please don't get me wrong...I do not have it out for Americans: I am one, some of my best friends are Americans, my sons and daughters have even married Americans. I'm just saying that generally, as Americans, we can be more parochial than other segments of the world society.

And as to your question about naturalised Americans, my reference about the general laziness of learning a second language is to Americans for which English is their first language and who do not have a "cultural necessity" to learn another language. True, Spanish may soon eclipse English in some states and already has in some regions of the US as the most prevalent spoken language, but the question remains, "Do we Americans who are not 'forced' to learn a language besides English make the effort to do so?"

100% of American high school students must study [a] language other than English to graduate...

I'll leave it up to other American Tek-Tipsters to respond to your assertion. As for my response: You probably live in New York or New Jersey if that is a requirement, but it is certainly an avoidable graduation requirement in many (if not most) other US states. In many/most states, the language requirement is "swappable" with a science or math alternative. [Another educational shame.]

And Crystal,

Is it hard to understand that as large as USA is it is only fare for others to adopt language of majority

If I am not mistaken, if we learned languages based upon "majority rule", then we'd probably be speaking either Mandarin/Cantonese or Hindi. Obviously, because of the historical impact of English-speaking economies on the rest of the world, English has become a de facto standard, so the rest of the world has learned to speak it to do business. It just do not believe that that fact absolves us as Americans from learning at least one other language (and I don't mean C++, Pascal, HTML, PHP, et cetera).

Next, Crystal, I believe you misunderstood my point/comment about "illiterates or idiots". To confirm my position and so no one misunderstands: I believe it is totally wrong to consider someone as lower intelligence just because the do not speak English. That was my point and any other assessment is mistaken.

Lastly, I do not consider Japanese to be the "blessed language" that all American students should learn. My belief is that all American youth should learn one or more foreign languages. It improves their intellects; it improves their horizons, it improves their appreciation for others, and it can diminish the "Ugly American" perceptions by the rest of the world. Conversely, is there anyone who would assert that American youth are known for their multi-lingual skills? I would be pleased if American youth were even know for their English skills.

Bottom line: I'm not trying to beat up on Americans (of which I am one); I am not criticizing any other culture, language, or people of the world. I'm a lover not a fighter.

Mufasa
(aka Dave of Sandy, Utah, USA)

http://www.dasages.com

Do you use Oracle and live or work in Utah, USA?
Then click here to join Utah Oracle Users Group on Tek-Tips.

 

[Stella740pl]

Stella, please don't get me wrong...I do not have it out for Americans

Well, I don't get you wrong, I hope. I am one of those immigrants. Am I American? (If so, then count me, too. I speak 3 languages (1 is rusty, though), understand some more. My daughter speaks 2 - one at home, one in school, and studies 3rd one as a foreign language. My husband speaks 4 to a different degree. Most of my relatives and friends are at least bilingual, and my daughter's school friends, too.)

Well, I admit, I don't really know about the whole America, but my daughter, and her friends from different schools, and friends' kids, and so on, all study languages. So I was under impression it's everywhere like that. Can they really speak it? That's another matter. Some people couldn't learn languages if their life depended on it, not only school grades.

I started to study English in school as a foreign language, too. Now that I live over 10 years in USA, I can probably say that I know a language to a decent level.

Do I say that generally Americans are known for their multi-lingual skills? I don't say that, but I would not compare them to Brits in that - it's not a valid comparison.