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So, does this turn anyone else off?

So, does this turn anyone else off?

So, does this turn anyone else off?

(OP)
I've been looking on and off for a T-Shirt designer to include on our web site.  Something like you see here:  http://www.customink.com/lab/#shared

Many of the sites I have found don't want to sell you the software; they want to host the site with the designer.  Some are offering to do it all, including the printing (which would of course be in competition... we're a print shop).

So, to the point.

Does anyone else just say "Forget it" if the web site is full of grammatical errors, where they are obviously marketing to an english-speaking audience, but it's broken english at best?

For example (from a page where I found a product, but then went on to read about features:

Quote:


Professional and customizable store design
It is very important for us to give our stores a corporate looks. This helps them in developing the trust worthiness in their customers. They also get a competitive edge over their competitors. You can choose the template, and unique box design that suits your needs better. This is not all... we have another great news for you.

Quote:


While using the application, if you come across any problem, then you can download our website planner document. Here you can put in your queries, and we will take of the rest. (Note: For these services you might need to shell out some extra bucks)

So... impression not made.  I stopped bothering to look at whether or not their product would fit my needs; I was so turned off by their horrid sales pitch it didn't matter any longer.
 

Just my 2¢

"What the captain doesn't realize is that we've secretly replaced his Dilithium Crystals with new Folger's Crystals."

--Greg  http://parallel.tzo.com
 

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

I agree completely, Greg.

It is similar (in my opinion) to travelling on a commercial airliner...if there are coffee stains on my tray table it scares me -- if they are lousy on simple cabin maintenance, then how are they on maintaining the engines?

As the motto says, "One does not get a second chance to make a first impression." If an obviously English-second-language website is so low on working capital that they cannot get a qualified English speaker to review their website impression, then I will certainly choose another option.

 santaMufasa
(aka Dave of Sandy, Utah, USA)
"People may forget what you say, but they will never forget how you made them feel."

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

==> Does anyone else just say "Forget it" if the web site is full of grammatical errors ...
Often, yes.
 

--------------
Good Luck
To get the most from your Tek-Tips experience, please read
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Wise men speak because they have something to say, fools because they have to say something.  - Plato

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

Quote:

If an obviously English-second-language website is so low on working capital that they cannot get a qualified English speaker to review their website impression
I wonder whether, in some cases, it is a website where English is not their second language - they really are just that bad, or simply could not be bothered to check what they had written.

I know it is possible for someone to be utterly terrible at their first languge, yet still be very competent at running their business, but to be honest, I'd tend to assume it is unlikely, and give them a wide berth.

Tony

 

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

I'd avoid it too.

I find it amazing that some companies with multi-million (insert currency of choice) turnover don't go to the effort of locating a fluent (insert language of choice here) speaker to review their web sites and software UIs; a great example are Asian hardware manufacturers such as, to choose a random example, Gigabyte.  I'm thrilled with the design and quality of the motherboard they manufactured... but the horrible mistakes and dreadful design of their support site and driver/configuration software turn my stomach!

Annihilannic
tgmlify - code syntax highlighting for your tek-tips posts

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

I generally agree, I'd run too...

but to most of these people, who write that, tend to NOT see that as a problem and it may even be seen as CORRECT usage of the language...

I've seen lots of Germans, as an example, Programmers that can turn out a pretty nifty and congenial piece of software, and even explain it in pretty good German, but fail totally when they try to translate that to English. Even though English is taught in schools, they still try to use German grammar on English sentences and fail miserable...

Ben
"If it works don't fix it! If it doesn't use a sledgehammer..."
How to ask a question, when posting them to a professional forum.
Only ask questions with yes/no answers if you want "yes" or "no"

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

I like the irony of a pitch trying to explain the importance of making a good first impression making a bad first impression.

Many years I tried to convince my wife, a native Chinese speaker, that we should start a side business translating technical documentation and marketing material from Chinese into correct English.

The importance of impression, and the consequences of a poor one was to be a major element of our sales pitch.

Unfortunately she never got interested in the concept, and I don't speak Chinese well enough.

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

I just read this warning on infopackets.com

Quote:

Another way to tell if a website is legitimate: check for spelling and grammar errors. If the site-builders can't correctly spell their own site's name or its major pages, chances are it's a fake, and probably a dangerous place for Internet users to visit.

James P. Cottingham
I'm number 1,229!
I'm number 1,229!

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

for me
a lot depends on what the companies line of business is * where they are based.

I can accept grammatical errors on the technical pages of a foreign hardware manufacturer but if the company is selling design services then i would treat their own site as an example of their work.

So in this case it is not a good advert if their own site contains spelling & grammar errors or looks poor

I would also expect it to pass the W3c validation tests as well
it is amazing how many "Professionally" produced sites do not.
 

Computers are like Air conditioners:-
Both stop working when you open Windows

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

Poor spelling and grammar is starting to show up more in formal communication. I believe this is because we have accepted it in informal communication such as texting and posting quick messages on Twitter and Facebook.

An entire generation has grown into adulthood with the technology and they see nothing wrong with poor grammar and spelling.  

I keep trying to do something about my procrastination but I keep putting it off until tomorrow.

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

I think another factor also comes into play - at least with a part of the population.  Society is generally more anti-authoritatrian than it has been in the past - certainly much more so than when I was a kid - and insisting on correct use of language is seen as being an authoritarian trait.  Consequently, in some cases at least, I suspect that people make deliberate mistakes so as not to seem to be too compliant to authority.

Tony

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

Quote (Tony):

I suspect that people make deliberate mistakes so as not to seem to be too compliant to authority.
Seriously Tony? Anyone who is that preoccupied with trying to show their rebellious nature is not someone I would feel safe around. Again, using the airliner analogy...who would want to fly on a commercial aircraft that had a rebellion activist as its mechanic?

santaMufasa
(aka Dave of Sandy, Utah, USA)
"People may forget what you say, but they will never forget how you made them feel."

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

Seriously Santa.  

Several friends of mine are teachers, or otherwise employed in schools.  They report being surrounded by kids who are perfectly capable of speaking properly, but who choose not to do so - especially when their peers are around - as this is seen as "sucking up to authority".  

This attitude is quite pervasive in some quarters.

Tony

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

So, extending that notion, do these same kids have drivers' licenses? Do they disobey traffic rules because they don't want to appear that they are "sucking up to authority"?

Additionally, they may rebel until they have to try to hold down a job. It is amazing how compliant rebels become when they have to pay for their iPhone, or rent, or food, et cetera.

 santaMufasa
(aka Dave of Sandy, Utah, USA)
"People may forget what you say, but they will never forget how you made them feel."

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

==> They report being surrounded by kids who are perfectly capable of speaking properly, but who choose not to do so ...
This attitude is quite pervasive in some quarters.

I suspect that in most cases, this attitude in indirectly proportional to needs.  I have no doubt these most of these kids will continue to not suck up only as long as it's convenient to not such up.  Don't provide safe harbor.

--------------
Good Luck
To get the most from your Tek-Tips experience, please read
FAQ181-2886: How can I maximize my chances of getting an answer?
Wise men speak because they have something to say, fools because they have to say something.  - Plato

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

(OP)
I say, let the kids do what they want.  Pierce themselves.  Have blue hair.  Tattoos all over the place.

That's less competition for MY line of work.  ;)

 

Just my 2¢

"What the captain doesn't realize is that we've secretly replaced his Dilithium Crystals with new Folger's Crystals."

--Greg  http://parallel.tzo.com
 

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

Santa, I'm just saying what happens - I'm not saying it is a good idea.

This is fairly large bunch of kids we're talking about here - the vast majority, in some schools, exhibit this behaviour at least to some extent.

That pool of kids eventually do all kinds of jobs, though the mean is probably a bit less academic than the national average.  For many of them, their peers continue to be from the same group and their language patterns remain similar.  For the rest, as they acquire more peers who use the language differently, and as economic realities kick in - such as being told that, if they want to keep their jobs, they need to speak differently - they may eventually moderate their abuse of language to some degree.  But you still end up with a sizable fraction of people who have websites and little appreciation for correct use of language.

OK, I'm not a sociologist, and I can't point to mounds of peer-reviewed data to prove the above, but I think it is a reasonable general assessment based on my own observations and those of my friends who deal with lots of kids.  I'll admit I may be wrong to some extent, but I doubt that I'm entirely wrong.  

I will concede my views are a tad parochial, i.e. applicable to the UK, mainly Manchester, Stevenage and Bristol.  I can easily believe that the youth in Utah are a much less stroppy bunch.

Tony




   

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

The thread is leaning toward defining the 99%, the Occupy group, who are complaining that they can't get hired, that other people make all the money. They've largely created their own problem. It takes parents to stop this at the source - but the parents who can and do aren't having nearly as many kids as those who don't.

Fred Wagner

  

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

"The thread is leaning toward defining the 99%, the Occupy group, who are complaining that they can't get hired, that other people make all the money. They've largely created their own problem. It takes parents to stop this at the source - but the parents who can and do aren't having nearly as many kids as those who don't. "
Let's not generalize all that consist of the Occupy Group as lazy, misguided, in their situation because of themselves anarchists.  I would consider to align more with the fundamental views of the "Occupiers" and I talk normally, spell correctly with correct grammar(well I try with the occasional slip up...), have a college degree(a real one), and am not a drain on society although I sympathize.  Every group has extremist, let us not band all with the brand of the extreme.

General Views(although an obvious bias towards the movement): http://www.freerangelongmont.com/2012/01/16/occupy-movement-demands-fundamental-change/

Sorry to get off topic....

"You don't know what you got, till it's gone..
80's hair band Cinderella or ode to data backups???"

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

Dr. Bob

I think we are getting two tiered society.   Those with enough education to move forward and those that don't.   Thirty years ago it didn't matter as much, if you had a high school diploma you could find a job and support a family.   Today that isn't the case.  I point to our government allowing this to happen.  Not being proactive to ensure that all of the US citizens can find work.  Do any of you folks notice alot more pickup trucks with signs for home improvement or what have you driving around.  

Jim C.
 

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

    
And then there are people with college degree that cannot find any jobs in their field to save their lives.  Some of them are from the Occupy group.  I've seen several TV programs and listened to some radio programs about some of those people, and – surprise – their college degree was in gender studies, classical studies, art history, and my favorite: puppetry.  It just screams: do you want to have fries with that?

Have fun.

---- Andy

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

People with those types of "majors" and "degrees" should not be surprised when they cant find a job outside of the manager for a McJob.

Back on track, Ive personally searched for random parts for laptops, servers, mills and lathes and when I find a site that doesn't take time to translate properly, I continue to look elsewhere.

"I know it is possible for someone to be utterly terrible at their first languge, yet still be very competent at running their business, but to be honest, I'd tend to assume it is unlikely,"
I missed that above quote by N1GHTEYES but think that it rings true.  If you are not willing to take time to do the small things, how can I rely on you for the big things?

"You don't know what you got, till it's gone..
80's hair band Cinderella or ode to data backups???"

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

Did I really say "languge" when I was condemning people for sloppy English?  Oh dear.

So that's what a petard feels like...

Tony

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

I wish they would do a study on purposely misspelled words in a sentence and see how many our brain auto-corrects.

(I didn't see it either :( )

"You don't know what you got, till it's gone..
80's hair band Cinderella or ode to data backups???"

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

It's also more than just a degree.   I've seen 1000 people come  and go over the years at my currnt place of employemnt, over two decades,  and it doesn't make any difference where you got your degree.  Either you are a good worker and employeee, or your not.   The ones getting term'd make every excuse for themself's and blame everybody for their short comings.   All work is good and noble,  it doesn't matter what it is.  But some people let their ego or whatever get in the way of doing the JOB.

Jim C.
 

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

Quote (Jim C.):

I point to our government allowing this to happen.  Not being proactive to ensure that all of the US citizens can find work.
Oh, yes, Jim, pleeeeeease...that's just what we all need...a government that is "proactive (enough) to ensure that all of the U.S. citizens can find work"! And while we're at it, the government should ensure that everyone has a working car, doesn't eat too much sugar or have more than 1 child, has a nice house, all the clothes that they need, a wide-screen TV, on-demand healthcare, and toilet paper that isn't scratchy when we use it. <grin>

santaMufasa
(aka Dave of Sandy, Utah, USA)
"People may forget what you say, but they will never forget how you made them feel."

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

Dave,

When I was I little lad a man could earn enough to buy a house feed his family and have enough left over to save a little.  Now you need at least two good incomes and that isn't always enough.   That's what I'm talking about.  I don't expect the feds to give me anything, but I do hope they stay out of my pocket long enough so that I can take care of my family.   I think you missed the point of my rant, or I didn't make my point clear enough.   I think that it is the governments job to stay out of the way and allow us to make a living and not keep reaching into our pockets every time they get a big idea on how to make our lives better.   Everybody who wants a job should be able to find one, ( assuming they really wanty to WORK ).   The last 20 years or fed gov has had their head in the sand and allowed jobs to move away.  

Jim C.

 
 

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

Quote:

I wish they would do a study on purposely misspelled words in a sentence and see how many our brain auto-corrects.
I think there was something similarly done:

http://www.mrc-cbu.cam.ac.uk/people/dennis.norris/personal/KinoshitaNorrisTransposedLetter.pdf

Ben
"If it works don't fix it! If it doesn't use a sledgehammer..."
How to ask a question, when posting them to a professional forum.
Only ask questions with yes/no answers if you want "yes" or "no"

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

Quote (Jim):

Everybody who wants a job should be able to find one, ( assuming they really wanty to WORK ).   The last 20 years or fed gov has had their head in the sand and allowed jobs to move away.
First, if the government guarantees a job to everyone, then please refer to the failed experiment that we called the Soviet Union. If the government wants to prevent jobs in the U.S. from disappearing to the Philippines, China, India, et cetera, the U.S. cannot stand at the border and prohibit jobs growing legs. The government also cannot impose their will by taxing companies for every job lost to a foreign country.

Instead, the best (and only) way for the U.S. government to bring jobs back to the U.S. is to make it more profitable for companies to have workers in the U.S. than it is to have them off shore. The way to make that happen is to reduce the cost of having employees here. The way to reduce such costs is to reduce the taxes that they impose on employers (or even make financial incentives) for having employees here.

I've heard the argument, "Corporations should pay their fair share in taxes." Well guess who pays corporate taxes! Corporations don't pay corporate taxes...Consumers pay corporate taxes in the form of corporations folding in the cost of their taxes (as they do with their other corporate expenses) into the cost of the goods and services that they sell.

So, in reality, when the government reduces the costs (read "taxes") that they impose on corporations, then the result is:
  • Reducing the costs of goods and services
  • Increasing the demand for U.S. goods and services (since the cost of such has gone down, thus making the goods and services more competative with foreign goods and services)
  • Making the creation (and continuation) of U.S. businesses more likely (read "profitable")
  • Improving the profitability of employing U.S. workers
So, the worst possible influence that the U.S. government can have in keeping U.S. jobs in the U.S. is to threaten to raise taxes (employment or otherwise) on U.S. corporations.

santaMufasa
(aka Dave of Sandy, Utah, USA)
"People may forget what you say, but they will never forget how you made them feel."

RE: So, does this turn anyone else off?

And, BTW, this off-topic tangent that Jim and I have collectively taken this thread onto, would be more appropriate (if anyone wants to pursue the tangent topic) in the Squaring The Circle forum.

santaMufasa
(aka Dave of Sandy, Utah, USA)
"People may forget what you say, but they will never forget how you made them feel."

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