Registering SIP and H.323 phones and CM System Limits

[learningSkype]

hi all, if you've worked on CM's for a long time, you know the "display capacity" command fairly well and you know that page 12 shows "current usage counts". we have several CM's running 6.3 and we've hit our system limit of 18,000 IP stations. it happened, we weren't expecting it so we started thinking of ways to fix this problem. the immediate thought was, let's convert phones to SIP and that cuts down on the amount of H.323 registrations and it gives us some breathing room.
my question to you all is this:
does the 18,000 system limit in CM apply to both H.323 endpoints registered to CM and SIP endpoints registered to SMGR? Registering phones to SMGR as SIP shouldn't impact the system limit in CM but it's a question that came up, so hoping someone here has experience in this matter or can point me to a doc that spells it out.
personally i don't think that phones registered as SIP to SMGR impact system limits in CM but i could be wrong.

 

[Wanebo]

Whether you phone is SIP registered to the session manager or not you are still using the communication manager as a feature server for that user, so yeah your licensing limit applies to either configuration of a set. SIP can allow more concurrent logins for that programmed station, but you still need to have that programmed station licensed.

You are probably better served for the short term by finding sets that haven't registered to the CM for a month or two, and deleting them to reclaim the licenses. After that gains you a little breathing room next you should audit what you have programmed vs what you have deployed out in the real world. Do you really need those phantom stations or could they be xports instead? Do you have multiple sets for a single user programmed in H.323 with bridged appearances that could be converted to SIP and allowed multiple concurrent logins to free up using multiple licenses for the H.323 stations? That kind of stuff. Then maybe think about moving more over to SIP to help clean up administration of the system in one centralized location.

My bet is with that volume of programmed sets is that you have quite a bit of wasted licenses. Remember that even if your waste ratio of licensing is as low as 2% (it's not. No one's is even close to being that low unless you have just completely audited) that's 360 wasted licenses.

 

[learningSkype]

thanks for the reply. Kyle555, if you're out there, would be great to hear your take as well.

 

[kyle555]

If you're on 6.0, you hit an offer limit.
Look under Voice Terminals:

https://downloads.avaya.com/css/P8/documents/100093229

Upgrade to 6.2 or later at its 36000. The Guardian program didn't come in until 6.3 - basically your license file has a date that your support ends/ended adn you're not allowed installing patches more current than the end of your maintenance.

Tough part is going to be finding 6.2 install media since Avaya can't distribute it anymore. Something about some 3rd party software they stopped licensing.

That, or top up on SIP phones.

 

[learningSkype]

ok so since we're running 6.3 we have the 36000 total limit. but going back to my question, what about the 18000 system limit for H.323 registrations? and do you agree with Wanebo's reply above or does the 36000 total mean that you can register any combination of phones as long as you mix them up between H.323 and SIP?

 

[kyle555]

I agree with Wanebo. Broadly speaking nowadays, your licenses are for 'aura users' either 'core users' or 'power users' that include a slew of things, including a PBX phone of any type you like. If you're a hotel, you can buy analog-only licenses, but that's more exception than rule.

That doesn't mean anyone will stop you from buying 50000 Aura Core users that you can't possibly configure on one CM.

I mentioned 6.0 because it did mention a limit of 18000 h323 stations, which is less a licensing constraint than a system constraint. It's the same limit in 6.3 and 8.0. I was mistaken when I'd said later releases can do all 36000 phones as H323.

Kinda makes sense. SM can pipe many phones to CM on 1 TCP socket whereas with h323 phones, CM has to juggle that socket for each endpoint.

I think the most appropriate statement would be that CM can only support 18K h323 phones and you'd need to get up to the limit with phones that can share a TCP socket with CM - be that SIP phones on SM or analog and digital phones on gateways where that gateway talks to CM on 1 socket and that gateway can support gaggles of phones.