PC Replacement/Upgrade Plan

[mozingod]

Has anyone ever set one of these up? I've been asked by managment to decide on a plan for this. It's for a bearing plant with about 64 PCs, of which maybe 20 of the shop floor PCs are ~75Mhz w/16M and 1G hdd's. They want the following two objectives met:

A. Formulate plan to continually upgrade all plant PC's, printers and misc. hardware
B. Recommend replacement scenario(s) with timing and cost

I have no idea on where to start with this. I was looking at also possibly putting Thin clients on the shop floor which would help with the greese/dirt problem out there too. Anyone have any tips from experience? A starting point... anything? Thanks!

Darrell Mozingo

 

[CSCWheels]

Are any of the floor boxes controlling machinery??
Also consider if these machines being controlled are dependent on software that may not run on the likes of an XP box or an NT station.

 

[mozingod]

They mostly run Ensync... a time/part tracking software. It's about 8 years old, I'll have to check on its ability to run on a new OS. The ones controlling the machinery is integrated into the machine and beyond my control, so I don't really have to worry about them.

Darrell Mozingo

 

[ceh4702]

First thing you need to do is make an inventory. They should have an inventory system of some kind but you probably need to look at each one and see what the processor speed and memory is for each machine. Then you can prioritize the order of replacement. Should probably have a system for Software License management also.

I work at a small college and we have hundreds of PC's so we get a discount and order say 50-200 at a time and we order them all from the same place so we get a sizeable discount. We order PC's to replace the best LAB PC's first. Then we cascade the PC's to other locations that are a lower priority. We got rid of all of our P266 and below PC's last year.

You need to figure out how many to order at one time based on a budget of some kind. You may want to look at the price for a single PC and then see what kind of discounts you can get if you order 5,10,20,30,40,60, etc at one time. If these are going to be in a harsh environment you may need special cases or something. Your program can probably run fine on a PIII Celeron computer. They do not run very hot and probably would do well in a harsh environment. Likewise, a P4/Celeron would be a nice choice also. It depends what is on sale at any given time. The computers in the office may have to be nicer so the secretary and management can surf the web, handle databases, or whatever it is they use them for. So if you have to order computers get office computers and possibly cascade the ones in the office out to other areas in the plant. If you are looking for tax issues sometimes if you spend a lot of money you might get tax incentives for your company that can offset the investment. So it might be nice to time a purchase toward the end of a calendar year so you might ask the accountant or whoever handles the books.

You may find places like DELL or IBM will have a PC targeted for the business community at a good price. You can probably get a good discount if you make a big order. don't be afraid to ask for a discount! Shop around and have written estimates and tell them what vendor A gave you for a price quote and see what they say. We use only IBM computers. IBM staffs one of our open community access computer labs as part of the deal. Therefore, we order all the PC's from one vendor. I recommend either IBM or DELL. Both are large firms that can service your PC's. It may be a calculated risk to order PC's from a local firm if you can get a deal, but my experience tells me they go out of business too often and their gaurantee would go out of business too.

We also have a blanket insurance agreement on all data processing equipment that is no longer under warranty. You may need to monitor when the warranty runs out for parts and labor.

If you do not like my post feel free to point out your opinion or my errors.

 

[mozingod]

A lot of that was very helpful. We're a smaller plant that's part of a global company... one of the largest steel/bearing producers in the world. We already have an agreement with IBM at the moment to supply PCs, but the prices are upwards of $1000 due to a 3yr warantee. I was looking to knock that price down a bit by custom building them. Thanks for the help, I'll have to keep attacking this from different angles!

Darrell Mozingo

 

[nlm9802]

hmm.. personally I don't see the need to upgrade much..

if the workstations will just be running an 8 year old program you can probably get an excellent deal buying someone's retiring fleet of p3 500's.
That way you can keep your os (NT?) and not have to spend a penny on software/licenses.

I don't see the need for a p4 when you can spend 1/3 the $$ and get essentially the same performance, as well as be assured that the workstations will be able to run since it will be the same os.

you should also get a copy of 2000 or xp and test everything that runs on the workstations now for compatibility. Obviously you can't install it on the 75Mhz machines, but one of the better ones would be a good start. Then call around, check ebay for people selling 100 p3 500's, etc.

The only downside to it is you probably won't get more than a 90 day warranty, but fixing p3's is cheap

Nick
Computer Support, no not just hardware.. I support everything

 

[ceh4702]

1,000 is not too bad, but it might be possible to use 100% integrated motherboards for PIII or similar products at quite a bit less. Sometimes at some online stores like

http://www.tigerdirect.com

they sell closeout models or bare bones models.

You can probably save quite a bit if you purchase motherboards with Inetl integrated graphics and plop down a celeron processor for around $60-$90. Intel has some chipsets out targeted for Integrated motherboards. Asus has a generic motherboard brand called ASROCK that a lot of system builders use. So an integrated motherboard is around $60.00. If you were really cheap they could run off of PC133 SDRAM. Since these are Micro-ATX Motherboards you could put them in a cheap A-OPEN Case or maybe a case from EVERCASE USA. They sell cases for 20.00 with no power supply. They are pretty normal looking cases and have that generic look to them. Then just put in some 4500 RPM Drives and a Antec 300W Power supply. Sometimes you can get some pretty inexpensive drives at places like Best Buy.

Go to a site like

http://www.newegg.com

if you want to buy your own hardware on-line. I love all their pictures. They have a wide selection of hardware. My suggestion if you really want to try this is to build one computer as a test to see if you are up to the task to see what it costs. By not installing things like sound cards and fancy video cards, you can save time and money. If you have one computer set up build all of them the exact same way. Then you can clone the operating system and just copy the hard drive as a mirror image. This means a fast installation process.

I really prefer Asus motherboards if they fit in the budget. It is hard to find the PIII motherboards anymore, so it might be easier to use 400 Mhz P4 Motherboards. I think Soyo still sells a PIII/Celeron MB with the Intel i815ep chipset that works with Tulatin Core Celerons up to 1.4 Gig.

I have a computer at home that is based on a via EPIA 800Mhz C3 processor Mini-ITX motherboard. You may laugh, but a system could fit in a shoebox. They mount the processor permanently on the MB to use less space. This means the MB and the processor together might run $120 for the 800 Mhz model. The Motherboard is 6.5" square. They have newer models out at around 1 Ghz. They run cooler, use less power and can easily run off of a Micro ATX/Fex ATX case with a 180-250 watt power supply. You can buy a small $30.00 case easily. Just dont buy the model with no Floppy Drive; It drove me nuts. It works fine without a floppy or a CDROM, if you are looking to run cool and save on electric costs. This might be nice for your antiquated software. I use mine to surf the net using broadband and have Office 97 running on it. Right now it is mounted on a pine board. I ordered a case for it, but I havent had a chance to set it up much. I bought it as a novelty. You can see one at

http://www.mini-itx.com.

If you put one in a standard case, no one will know the differnce.

Do a little homework and study on this subject. Here are some websites:

http://www.tomshardware.com

Hardware site with Forum

http://www.anandtech.com

Hardware site with Forum

http://www.pcmech.com

Hardware site with Forum

http://www.newegg.com

Store-Calif

http://www.motherboards.org

Motherboard ratings

http://www.tigerdirect.com

Store-Chicago

http://www.adamant.com

(Custom Built Computers)-Cincinatti, OH

I dont want to get you in trouble; if you start spending money you might want to just hire a local shop to build to your specifications. You can easily build a $500 computer but you still have to replace monitors. You can get a 19" monitor for $200.00.

If you do not like my post feel free to point out your opinion or my errors.

 

[mozingod]

Yea, thanks. I'm well aware of all the custom built options, but ordering from anywhere but our "designated" dealers is kinda fround apon. We need PO's and everything, plus the wounderful (hah!) corporate standards to follow. I'm trying to push lower end machines like you both mentioned. Thanks!

Darrell Mozingo

 

[ceh4702]

IBM has a new line of computers called "think centre". They are similar to the old Net Vista computers. I have a NetVista 1.8 Gig P4 at work and it runs pretty well. Just by using Celeron processors with integrated motherboards you can save $200.00 per computer or so. Even if you order from your regular supplier you should be able to save money this way.

You might try something like this. Get them to order one full blown computer with a P4 and one with an integrated board and a Celeron. Label one A and one B covering up any identification/logos. Then have them test them both to compare. This is pretty harmless. Call it a blind test. Another option is to order just one Integrated Celeron to see if they like it. I wonder if your supplier has a display showing both so you can see them?

Sometimes when we want to buy software, we find another business with that software and go and see what it is like. Maybe you can find another business with Lower-End integrated computers with celerons and go and investigate if they can see the difference.

If you do not like my post feel free to point out your opinion or my errors.