"'Tis an ill wind that blows no minds." - Malaclypse the Younger
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FYI, re: WIn 98 support
- Thread starter carrr
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"'Tis an ill wind that blows no minds." - Malaclypse the Younger
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diogenes10
Technical User
Something I've been wondering about,
for win98 when I go to windows update I see 13 critical updates and service packs.
For the first one below IE6, the security bulletin is dated July, 2003. For the second one the security bulletin is dated November, 2002.
When I compare 2 updates to the furor about security breaches in windows products and the admonitions to keep your computer updated, I get ?????? in my mind.
Is there really a serious level of support for win98 now anyway?
for win98 when I go to windows update I see 13 critical updates and service packs.
For the first one below IE6, the security bulletin is dated July, 2003. For the second one the security bulletin is dated November, 2002.
When I compare 2 updates to the furor about security breaches in windows products and the admonitions to keep your computer updated, I get ?????? in my mind.
Is there really a serious level of support for win98 now anyway?
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- #4
Well............considering that M$oft just came out with their answer to the Blaster virus last week, I'm not sure how serious a level of support there is for much of anything. (This is kind of intended tongue in cheek...but....)
"'Tis an ill wind that blows no minds." - Malaclypse the Younger
"'Tis an ill wind that blows no minds." - Malaclypse the Younger
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- #6
Well...MS isn't resurrecting support, really, for 98, just prolonging its end of life.
We still run a lot of 9x machines and have a couple hundred 3.1 machines scattered around the state. I'm not sure what the proportionality would like for 95 or 3.1 globally, but you'll note that the article said 20% of windows boxes out there were 9x (I'm going to venture that a major chunk of that is 98, but....). I saw another piece that had the 9x share as high as 25%.
"'Tis an ill wind that blows no minds." - Malaclypse the Younger
We still run a lot of 9x machines and have a couple hundred 3.1 machines scattered around the state. I'm not sure what the proportionality would like for 95 or 3.1 globally, but you'll note that the article said 20% of windows boxes out there were 9x (I'm going to venture that a major chunk of that is 98, but....). I saw another piece that had the 9x share as high as 25%.
"'Tis an ill wind that blows no minds." - Malaclypse the Younger
Looking at global access stats by operating system for last month shows Win98 has 40% of the total amount, followed by 30% for Win2K and 19% for WinME.
Everything else is negligible in total numbers compared to those systems. Win95 BTW has 2% of the total number of visitors.
I know this isn't a 100% accurate way of getting overall system use, but its fairly representative of the global overall system use.
John
Everything else is negligible in total numbers compared to those systems. Win95 BTW has 2% of the total number of visitors.
I know this isn't a 100% accurate way of getting overall system use, but its fairly representative of the global overall system use.
John
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- #8
Good stats.
One can kind of see why they'd want to string things out.
Personally, I think it's numbers like this, rather than the altruistic motives they pubicly proclaim, that drive decisions like they're making.
"'Tis an ill wind that blows no minds." - Malaclypse the Younger
One can kind of see why they'd want to string things out.
Personally, I think it's numbers like this, rather than the altruistic motives they pubicly proclaim, that drive decisions like they're making.
"'Tis an ill wind that blows no minds." - Malaclypse the Younger
diogenes10
Technical User
John
I wasn't arguing for resurrection/extension of support for old or current products. I'm just wondering if there is really that much support going on now that "dropping it" would make that much difference.
I'm not very knowledgeable about those issues, but I wonder if the bigger long term issue might not be that application developers will feel free to drop win9x from list of supported os's (apologize if that's a bad apostrophe) as soon as MS puts out the formal "Dropping It" notice.
I wasn't arguing for resurrection/extension of support for old or current products. I'm just wondering if there is really that much support going on now that "dropping it" would make that much difference.
I'm not very knowledgeable about those issues, but I wonder if the bigger long term issue might not be that application developers will feel free to drop win9x from list of supported os's (apologize if that's a bad apostrophe) as soon as MS puts out the formal "Dropping It" notice.
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- #10
diogenes,
I'm running a little slow today, but...it just hit me what you were angling towards--I think.
It seems to me that the lack of updates for 98 may be due to the fact that 1) they've already done what's needed to be done, or 2) the fact that those looking for holes in MS products have moved on to shinier targets, i.e. XP.
While I had a hell of a time patching XP systems when Blaster, et al. came around a few months back, I didn't have to touch a 9x box.
"'Tis an ill wind that blows no minds." - Malaclypse the Younger
I'm running a little slow today, but...it just hit me what you were angling towards--I think.
It seems to me that the lack of updates for 98 may be due to the fact that 1) they've already done what's needed to be done, or 2) the fact that those looking for holes in MS products have moved on to shinier targets, i.e. XP.
While I had a hell of a time patching XP systems when Blaster, et al. came around a few months back, I didn't have to touch a 9x box.
"'Tis an ill wind that blows no minds." - Malaclypse the Younger
Microsoft is continuing support, though how extensive I don't know, but it will be a true shame if they ever did fully cut out Windows 98 from their support. There are a lot of companies that are bound to old DOS software and Windows 98 is the most current OS they can run, because all the NT & XP stuff has abandonded MS-DOS compatibility. There are many specialized software too that uses security dongles that will not work in 2000/XP, making Win98 the only option for them.
diogenes10
Technical User
carrr
Yes, you're seeing the direction I was thinking. I've been considering ME over 98 because a) it was going to have "support" for a bit longer, and b) since it's later i thought maybe usb capabilities would be better. The counterweight to that is all the opinions I've seen expressed about ME, and that's where I was then getting to the thoughts I'd expressed above and wondering whether "support" was really an important consideration. Your sample of one practical experience points in the direction that it's not.
dakota
But isnt the market/environment headed in the direction
of abandoning dos and/or dos based windows for the nt or linux type apps? And if that is true and it is not desirable-does this extension of support step by Microsoft indicate that there is some way that the universe of customers you are concerned about can make further change or do they need to plan for change now?
(questions for the future of it forum and the ethics forum.)
Yes, you're seeing the direction I was thinking. I've been considering ME over 98 because a) it was going to have "support" for a bit longer, and b) since it's later i thought maybe usb capabilities would be better. The counterweight to that is all the opinions I've seen expressed about ME, and that's where I was then getting to the thoughts I'd expressed above and wondering whether "support" was really an important consideration. Your sample of one practical experience points in the direction that it's not.
dakota
But isnt the market/environment headed in the direction
of abandoning dos and/or dos based windows for the nt or linux type apps? And if that is true and it is not desirable-does this extension of support step by Microsoft indicate that there is some way that the universe of customers you are concerned about can make further change or do they need to plan for change now?
(questions for the future of it forum and the ethics forum.)
diogenes10
Technical User
dakota
I just reread and my last question is not very clear-I used change twice and didnt clarify its meanings to me.
And if that is true and it is not desirable-does this "extension of support" step by Microsoft indicate that there is some way that the universe of customers you are concerned about can make cause further change in the market (continued support for dos) or do they need to start planning now for operating system changes?
I just reread and my last question is not very clear-I used change twice and didnt clarify its meanings to me.
And if that is true and it is not desirable-does this "extension of support" step by Microsoft indicate that there is some way that the universe of customers you are concerned about can make cause further change in the market (continued support for dos) or do they need to start planning now for operating system changes?
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- #14
diogenes,
As far as scrapping 98 for ME???
I my opinion, 98 without support in better than ME with all the support in the world.
I'm pretty harsh on ME and often wonder why Microsoft EVER put it out. I think a lot of agreement is out there on this point.
"'Tis an ill wind that blows no minds." - Malaclypse the Younger
As far as scrapping 98 for ME???
I my opinion, 98 without support in better than ME with all the support in the world.
I'm pretty harsh on ME and often wonder why Microsoft EVER put it out. I think a lot of agreement is out there on this point.
"'Tis an ill wind that blows no minds." - Malaclypse the Younger
diogenes10
Technical User
carrr
I know there is a lot of agreement for that point of view. I have some trouble evaluating it because I have a home system that came with me and it doesnt seem to be giving me problems like I read about. But I've not used it in a work environment or a demanding multitasking environment.
I know there is a lot of agreement for that point of view. I have some trouble evaluating it because I have a home system that came with me and it doesnt seem to be giving me problems like I read about. But I've not used it in a work environment or a demanding multitasking environment.
Looks like support for these older OS's is to continue till 2006.
Apparently MS are worried that if theres no support available people may switch to other sellers OS's
Just getting back to what Diogenes said, I too got a PC with ME on it a few years ago and never had a problem so I am surprised to hear of many that do although this is a help forum so we are a bit blurred by the number of people who look for help on it. However I am glad I switched to XP as its much faster and friendly.
Also, just to point out above that blaster did effect random 9x machines and 9x are just as vulnerable to viri as the newer O.S's
"Sometimes I do not know but I try hard"- R.F. Haughty 1923
Apparently MS are worried that if theres no support available people may switch to other sellers OS's
Just getting back to what Diogenes said, I too got a PC with ME on it a few years ago and never had a problem so I am surprised to hear of many that do although this is a help forum so we are a bit blurred by the number of people who look for help on it. However I am glad I switched to XP as its much faster and friendly.
Also, just to point out above that blaster did effect random 9x machines and 9x are just as vulnerable to viri as the newer O.S's
"Sometimes I do not know but I try hard"- R.F. Haughty 1923
Just for more reading:
"Sometimes I do not know but I try hard"- R.F. Haughty 1923
"Sometimes I do not know but I try hard"- R.F. Haughty 1923
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kippy13,
This is the second time I've seen you mention that 9x boxes got the blaster worm.
You should inform AV companpanies AND Microsoft of this, as - according to you - they seem to be out of the loop:
"'Tis an ill wind that blows no minds." - Malaclypse the Younger
This is the second time I've seen you mention that 9x boxes got the blaster worm.
You should inform AV companpanies AND Microsoft of this, as - according to you - they seem to be out of the loop:
"'Tis an ill wind that blows no minds." - Malaclypse the Younger
Hi,
I am not saying that they got the worm, the worm tried to infect them and when a particuliar random event(I think the virus made a guess at a few things) occured it caused them not to boot up properly and intermittantly hang.
Heres what I found on a post:
"This isn't always true. A full install of office xp with frontpage
will make 98 open to this worm"
I may be wrong but around the same time as the blaster virus I had to rebuild about 15 percent of our Windows 98 machines.
"Sometimes I do not know but I try hard"- R.F. Haughty 1923
I am not saying that they got the worm, the worm tried to infect them and when a particuliar random event(I think the virus made a guess at a few things) occured it caused them not to boot up properly and intermittantly hang.
Heres what I found on a post:
"This isn't always true. A full install of office xp with frontpage
will make 98 open to this worm"
I may be wrong but around the same time as the blaster virus I had to rebuild about 15 percent of our Windows 98 machines.
"Sometimes I do not know but I try hard"- R.F. Haughty 1923
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- #20
Somehow I think that if this magical combination of "random events" and 98 with "full install of office xp with frontpage" had been a threat, there'd be a little better knowledge of it than a mention in a post.
"'Tis an ill wind that blows no minds." - Malaclypse the Younger
"'Tis an ill wind that blows no minds." - Malaclypse the Younger
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