Beginner's Question 2

[danielh68]

Hi,

I just purchased UltraDev to expand upon my web skills. In any case, I looked at the manual and it says that I need a web server of some sort (Windows 2000, NT, PWS). Do I really need a web server locally? My ISP supports ASP, so can I do development remotely or is it not wise to? I tried installing PWS, but it caused major problems with my system. I'm considering installing 2000 for development, but if I can do the same via ISP then I rather go that route. So, basically, my question is this: can I build dynamic pages locally and then test them through my ISP?

Thanks,
Dan

 

[mlawson]

Dan

There are many previous threads about this subject, the same answer is, Yes you can test locally and remotely, it depends on your ISP and your connection. I personally run Windows ME with PWS (it took a few goes to install properly) locally and use IIS 5 on a Windows 2000 server. If you plan to run primarily ASP pages then you will have to bite the bullet and persevere with PWS for local stuff. You could always try using the JSP model that UD offers, your CD bundle came with the websphere web server, the issue with that is finding a JSP based ISP. The problems are'nt big, just many.
If you are having problems getting PWS on your machine, post your exact problem, someone up there may know how to get round your problems (mine lay with the transaction server playing havoc with ME when I used the online download, it installed fine when I ran it off a Windows 98 SE install CD, huh?)

Hope you stick with it, I guess you'd better know you've invested in the CD!

M

 

[danielh68]

Thanks M, I'm going to continue to tinker with PWS and if that doesn't work I will go the remote route.

Thanks again,
Dan

 

[schase]

As much as my friend Lawson says,

I know your pain

I hate windows being so picky, and I never seem to have the time to mess with pws long enough to get it right

and I can never afford a crash.

So, ALL of my asp testing I do via isp, I do the changes, upload, and test. change, upload test. Most likely a bit longer in the process, but it works and I have no dangers.

If not wanting to drop an existing page is an issue - make a test directory.

and always use reserved Access names.... right Lawson? hehee kidding on the last part.

 

[danielh68]

Thanks for your suggestions. I have found PWS to be an unpredictable piece of software. I installed it on my P2, however part of the installation process was unsuccessful. I have tried to uninstall it, but now my machine freezes whenever I attempt to open the control panel. So as an alternative, I tried to uninstall it through the Windows 98 disc and it failed, too. Determined, I took my P1 out of the closet and installed PWS. Strangely, the installation was successful and I have even tested asp with it. Like, I said "strange". In any case, I will either connect it to my P3 via LAN or do the remote thing for testing. Funny how many hoops a developer has to jump through just to start developing.

Thanks again,
DanH

 

[mlawson]

As Mr Chase alludes to, we can all test as much on our local systems as we can, but it does ultimately lead to a little more time being spent on the final version (local testing, uploading, expletives, re-uploading, cursing the ISP for renaming the drive letter (see: DSN-less connections a month back or so), lots of coffee and more uploading.
If you can manage it then please adopt Mr Moneybags' (aka schase) suggestion and develop, load and delopy onto the final destination from the outset. This does solve problems with trying to test from local, slighty differently set up drives, and actually probably is as evenly matched time-wise as pretesting locally then uploading once you're a bit more wise, experienced and cynical (see any name on the top right! Moi?) with UD.

Enough already.

M

 

[schase]

lol moneybags? whered that come from

 

[mlawson]

Hey, some of us use telephone dial ups!!

M

 

[danielh68]

One more question, since your expertise (mlawson & schase) is present, I mentioned the problem with PWS & my P2 to the IT guy here at work and he said just reinstall Windows 98. Can you do that? Perhaps I was misinformed, but I thought it can blout your system with unnecessary files. I hope I'm wrong, because that would be an easy solution. Any insight on the matter?

Thanks,
DanH

 

[schase]

Actually, (although Mr. I Love my slow connection might disagree here) lol.

I found that installing win98 over itself will often fix things. Win95 had the nasty habit of really freaking out when it saw itself. But I havnt had any problems with win98SE.

And that usually will solve 99.9% of windows problems - reinstall OS.

BUT make sure you overwrite the default windows.000 as install location to just windows otherwise forget it.

Naturally i'd highely recommend backing up files you feel are necessary, address books, etc.

- oh get drivers first.

 

[danielh68]

Thanks schase,

Can you elaborate on the this:

BUT make sure you overwrite the default windows.000 as install location to just windows otherwise forget it.

I'm a tad unclear how the user overwrites windows.000.
So are you saying, if I insert the 98 disc and go through the default install procedure, I should be safe?

Thanks again,
Dan

 

[schase]

what happens is - and i'm assuming you have Windows 98 SE (Second edition)

It will go through a normal installation, ask you what you want to install, etc. then it asks you to what location.

And where you are installing over itself it will detect there is a c:\windows

So it will prompt you with something like this.
C:\Windows.000

Just remove the .000 bringing it back to c:\windows

 

[schase]

ohhh one thing

if it asks you

do NOT pick the Format first, then install.

just pick the insta..

Unless you are pretty comfortable in formatting - and not to take a chance on my end - this erases everything on your harddrive. do not do it. just pick the install - not format.

 

[danielh68]

Great! Thanks, schase. You have been incredibly helpful.

 

[schase]

lol insta..

hmm like that Lawson? thats what happens when your keyboard tries to catch up to your net connection

 

[mlawson]

Sorry just managed to get on to the Net, bl**dy dialup keeps bumping me out, Oh for the money to afford cable.



Interesting read guys, a lot of stuff going to and fro. One thing, Daniel, please tell us, are you running Win98 Second Edition, the reason, I'm guessing SC is asking about that is that there are numerous issues with the original edition of Windows98 that were remedied (!) with latter releases.

The other thing is ti ensure that you run your version of UD at the new upgrade level (ie 4.01, an upgrade is available from the MM mothership).

As an aside, when I purchased a new Hard Drive, I found that I had fewer problems when I installed all my windows components fully, then installed UD. It may seem logical but some folk never realised that they needed to install PWS, when they did, after they installed UD, they had numerous PWS installation issues. I know that they are separate progs etc.. but I have heard real heart breaking stories about folk giving up cauase of the installation of PWS.

On that cheery note, have fun!

M

 

[danielh68]

Yes, I have Windows 98 SE. Those are great suggestions that I will keep in mind. Thanks again for letting me tap into mlawson & schase knowledge bank.

 

[mlawson]

Here's hoping some of the less cynical remarks have helped!



M

"The journey of a thousand miles begins with a broken fanbelt"

 

[schase]

a

http://www cmon

you wernt that cynical hehe

 

[mlawson]

Cynical, Moi?

ho-hum.

M




"Do not walk before me for I may not follow, do not walk behind me for I may not lead, nor walk beside me. Just leave me the f*** alone!!" Ancient Scottish Saying (honest)