auto-logout users prior to backup

[msc0tt]

I have a problem with users not logging out for days at a time. My concern is the files they leave open during the nightly backup.
Is there a (3rd party?) console utility that will logout all current users? I already know about setting "login time restrictions" for each user in nwadmin, but I have hundreds of accounts, and the maintenance of this would be too much. We have NW411, Client32, no NAL, no ZEN. Also, I know about 'backup while in use' options, but this won't be acceptable for some of our apps.
-with thanks,
Mike.

 

[TheLad]

My advice is tell them "if you don't close your apps, your files don't get backed up"

Why go to the time and expense of trying to find a solution when a simple kick up the ar5e would suffice?

-----------------------------------------------------
"It's true, its damn true!"
-----------------------------------------------------

 

[msc0tt]

Well... because I'm a professional, and I'm responsible for the IT Department of a large company. Granted, I'm not too concerned if a user leaves open "my resume.doc" and it doesn't get backed-up. My real concern is something like our accounting application which holds open dozens of files. In the event of a tape recovery, I would hate to inform my accounting dept that I've had to go back n-days because user "x" left the app open overnight. Sure, I can point my finger at this user, but I still look like a clod for not anticipating the situation, and taking preventive action.

 

[marvhuffaker]

That's a tough deal, but that's when you have a meeting with the management, explain the problem. Then leave it up to management to make the decision. If they don't care, then you shouldn't either. But at least you have someone else to blame when things go bad.

Marvin Huffaker MCNE, CNE
Marvin Huffaker Consulting

http://www.redjuju.com

 

[MarkhP]

I haven't used this, but it may be of interest...

http://www.citadel.com/netoff.asp

If you feel that you must have the users logged off, and it has to be automated, then this may help?.

I think you may want to look at using backup software that can backup files that are in use possibly?. Arcserve-7 supported Netware 4.11 with a open file option for instance.

 

[msc0tt]

Thanks MarkhP for your post. I talked with someone at Citadel yesterday about Netoff. Their current version 7.5 is way too fat and feature rich for what I need. It is a full client-server model with bits-and-pieces everywhere. I even asked if I could consider earlier versions of Netoff, since clearly this utility evolved from a simple auto-logoff (what I need). Sadly, they can't do this.
I then found CLRUSR.NLM on an old forum. Virtually no docs, and I can't find the company that made it (1995). I tried it on a non-production NW411 server, and darned if it doesn't work!! You basically create an exceptions file SYS:SYSTEM\CLRUSR.DAT and put the usernames to NOT disconnect. For example:
BKUPEXEC
ADMINISTRATOR
NWGW

Now, when you load the NLM, it iterates through every active connection, and disconnects it if not present in the exceptions file. Once done, the NLM unloads cleanly. Exactly what I wanted!

Your comment about in-use backups is noted. We already use this feature (with BackupExec). Referring back to our accounting application, most of the files do backup while in use, but not all!?!? It must be how the application opens them (EXCLUSIVE MODE?). Anyway, this means to me that I don't have a COMPLETE backup of all the files to a specific time. Fortunately, I haven't had to test a full restore in this situation to see if it works or not. Obviously related databases (particularly accounting) like ALL the files to be in exact sync.

An earlier point about kicking ar5s, while very tempting at times, is unrealistic. I think this only works in the millitary ;-{). I've been in this business a long time, and I've learned to not try to curb human nature. Some people will always absentmindedly walk away from their workstation at the end of the day. Always have, always will. Over the years, I've done the 'nagging thing' but have grown weary of it.

I think that after some fair notice and user education, I can safely deploy an auto-logoff mechanism, and be done with this problem. Sure, there will be cases of abandoned applications/documents getting 'unplugged' overnight, but this is no different than a workstation crash with this same app running. For future viewers of this thread, I will post my results with CLRUSR.NLM. Based on my initial trials, I am quite optimistic.

 

[rjs]

The problem you WILL run into with clearing user connections that have open files, ESPECIALLY database files, is that the file is not closed "cleanly". It is like powering off the PCs with apps open instead of going to start, shutdown... Eventually, or even frequently, you will corrupt the database. So now you have a corrupt database and a backup of a corrupt database.

My 2 cents, if its worth that much.

R.Sobelman

http://www.tracklogins.com

 

[msc0tt]

rjs,
You must have stopped reading my 'lengthy' post before the last paragraph. I'm aware of this eventuality, but like I said, it will be no different than the workstation CRASHING with the database open (or a power failure at the workstation). Both events have occured (more than a few times), and neither has corrupted anything for us.

In your defense, it is possible that there are VERY-POORLY DESIGNED network applications that don't flush disk writes, but rather hold changes in memory. I'm sure they exist, but I've never suffered this experience.
-Mike

 

[MarkhP]

Mike,
There is an older version of netoff here :-

http://www.novellshareware.com/nlms.shtml#337

(says it is for 3.x, but may be worth a look?)

I dont know if you had this info re clrusr.nlm already, but here it is..

"...The exception file is called CLRUSR.DAT and must be located in the SYS:\SYSTEM directory. It is comprised of the users and stations not to clear if they are logged on. Each users name is entered one name or station address per line. For example when CLRUSR is run the following file :

SUPERVISOR
BACKUP
GEORGE
0020AF14E9DC

will prevent Supervisor, Backup, George and anyone logged in on the station with address 0020AF14E9DC from being cleared. You can get the station address by running fconsole and selecting connection information then
selecting other information. Only the last 12 bytes are needed the internetwork number should not be included...."

The company "WAS"

Classic SOFTWARE
1364 FAXON AVE
MEMPHIS TN 38104-6811

Thats it from me. I will let you get on with it now
Mark.