Athlon or P4?

[Fishguy]

Hey everybody!

I just recently fried my mobo and CPU; an Athlon XP 1600+ and an ECS K7S5A. Regardless, I wanted some input, should I purchase an Athlon XP 2500+ Barton with an Asus A7N8X Deluxe or a P4 2.4C(800Mhz FSB) with an Asus P4C800 Deluxe-UAY? and why?

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Fishguy

 

[franklin97355]

These are choices you need to make for yourself. Figure out what you want the system to do and what your priorities are then check the specs.

 

[dakota81]

Depends on how much cash you've got. The P4 you listed kicks the Athlon's butt, but you're paying extra for that speed.

If you're going with the P4, buy a motherboard with intel's 865 chipset, I'm not sure which Asus board that is you've listed. Also I think Asus has dubbed their enhancements "Hyper Path Technology", make sure this mobo supports this; mobo makers have been able to unlock the added enhancements of the 875 chipset that were supposidly disabled in the 865's.

 

[paparazi]

The Asus P4C800 Deluxe is based on the Intel 875 chipset and one of the best performing in it's class.
There seems little dought that the P4 2.4 800fsb is able to soundly beat the Athlon XP2.5+ on an Nforce2 motherboard
Seems that the NEW P4 2.4 performs slightly better than an XP2.7+ is most cases so I guess the real question should be:

What is the price comparison between the XP2.8+ on the Nforce2 Asus and the P4 2.4 800fsb on the Asus Intel 875.

Now on price point!! things may be a little more even???
because I know the Intel board is quite expensive.
Martin


Replying helps further our knowledge, without comment leaves us wondering.

 

[Fishguy]

Thanks guys,
Although I have been doing some research of my own these past few hours since I posted the original thread and in terms of "bang for your buck", the Athlon is at the head of it's game($170 less than the P4). As far as benchmarks go...I have seen that the P4 does boast greater memory bandwidth and higher clock speeds, but where it counts...Games, I have seen in benchmarks that I have reviewed, that the P4 and the Athlon are pretty much neck and neck. And apparently, using the Asus mobo, I can overclock the Athlon about 300-400Mhz without any major problems.
I know you think I should decide for myself, but I want to know what you guys would choose were you in my position.

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Fishguy

 

[cdogg]

Fishguy,
If you are still comparing the Athlon XP 2500+ to the P4 2.4GHz (w/800FSB), then I'm not sure what you mean about them being neck and neck. I guess it depends what where you're getting your benchmarks, but if you look at Tom's Hardware, you'll find that the P4 is 7-8% faster on average in many gaming benchmarks including 3DMark2001 and 3DMark2003 - CPU.

Here's the link in case you're interested:

http://www.tomshardware.com/cpu/20030521/800fsb-09.html

Even if you decide to compare the XP 2800+ instead, the P4 still wins out in every gaming benchmark (which appears to be the most important to you) and only costs $10 more. Before the 800FSB was available, I always recommended the Athlon XP over the P4 to those who want the best "Bang for buck". However, that gap has seriously closed IMO, and now you're talking $20 instead of $200.

Just another opinion for ya! Either will still be a good buy any way you look at it. I doubt you would really feel the 5% difference anyway...though bragging rights is always nice!

___________________________________________________________

"The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources"
[tab]- A. Einstein

 

[Fishguy]

Thanks for the advice,
Perhaps the benchmarks that I viewed were biased towards the Athlon or perhaps, as you suggested, the P4 was running on a 533Mhz Bus.

As for the price gap, I live in Canada and the prices are a little more, as is the price gap.

I purchase from a computer store in south Calgary called Memory Express and the prices I quote are their most recent.
Here is a link to their website if you would like to check for yourself:

http://www.memoryexpress.com

The price of the Athlon: $139.95
The price of the P4: $289.95

$289.95
-$139.95
--------
$150.00 Difference!!!
(The number I posted in a previous thread...$170, is the difference in total cost; CPU+Motherboard)

So as you can see, the price gap is still a little steep (for my taste).

Unless I hear some really compelling evidence to buy a P4, I am going to grab the Athlon and Asus mobo.

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Fishguy

 

[cdogg]

Yes, perhaps that's a restriction you'll have to deal with. However, if you look at some online dealers at Pricewatch.com, you'll see that prices for this P4 (retail boxed and warranty) is as low as $176.

http://www.pricewatch.com/1/3/5502-1.htm

Perhaps one of the dealers will ship to Canadian addresses for an extra fee? Oh well, it's good to consider all of your options anyway.

___________________________________________________________

"The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources"
[tab]- A. Einstein

 

[dakota81]

Keep forgetting in these posts; ditch that particular Asus model for the P4P800 Deluxe. There's two main differences in the 865PE & 875 chipsets; PAT & ECC memory support. I doubt you're using ECC memory, and mobo makers have been enabling PAT on the 865PE chips due to an oversight by intel in chip design. There's absolutely no reason to by the P4C800 Deluxe for the extra $40 it costs.

intel is working to make sure future 865PE chips cannot have PAT enabled, but in the mean time, grab one while you can!

 

[edemiere]

Personally, I'd say go with the Athlon. You will still have fast gaming and such while supporting the little fish in the big pond.

Only with the continued existence of comptetion will prices stay reasonable and innovation be a driving force!

I have an ASUS A7V8X-X and a Thorobred 2700+ and I have to say it rocks nicely!

Just my 2 cents on the subject.

Good luck whatever you decide to do...

 

[dakota81]

"supporting the little fish in the big pond"

Is that like buying a Yugo over a Chevy just to keep the small European manufacturers afloat?

 

[edemiere]

Not entirely the same argument when you consider there are dozens of car manufacturers.

Not to mention that AMD manufactures a high quality product as does Intel, just one company is bigger than the other. It'd be more like, buying a saturn because of the no haggle clause over going to a chevy dealership.

Later!

 

[ceh4702]

I would not buy a P4C800, I would buy a P4P800, if I wanted an Intel System. I have read articles which state the the 865 chipset will go just as fast as the 875 chipset. Why pay more for a measley 2-3 percent, when one setting in the BIOS will get the motherboard to go at the same speed. You can only get the top speeds under perfect conditions when you use DDR400 memory that works under the fastest timings. If you do not use DDR Memory, then the P4C800 has no advantage at all becuase PAL only works with DDR400 memory.

With the P4 you have to deal with adding memory in pairs of DDR DIMMs. This is where the Nforce chipset is better. You can save money because you can opt for one 500 Mhz DDR Dimm instead of two 2 DDR Dimms of 256 Mhz each. You can also add just one DDR DIMM at a time if you choose. The P4 has some advantages if you want to try to get up to 2 Gigs of RAM, but most people can get by with 512 Mhz-1 Gig of RAM.

Everything is a trade-off for something else.

If you do not like my post feel free to point out your opinion or my errors.

 

[cdogg]

I agree with the above. After reading many reviews on both the 865 and 875 chipsets, it hardly makes sense to go with the 875 unless you really need to use ECC memory. The Asus P4P800 is the better buy...

___________________________________________________________

"The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources"
[tab]- A. Einstein

 

[dakota81]

How many saw this last comment coming a mile away? So many fanboys dreaming that it's still 1999. =Þ

 

[CitrixEngineer]

Quote "Is that like buying a Yugo over a Chevy just to keep the small European manufacturers afloat?"

No - it's like buying a TVR over a Ferrari.

Let me qualify; The Ferrari has the image, the top speed and the price. The TVR is still extremely quick, with 0-60 under 4 seconds, top speed 215MPH (TVR 440R). Compare that to any Ferrari!However, TVR does not have the history, image or company size (Ferrari are, of course, owned by Fiat), although they're still great cars. They make up for this by being considerably cheaper.

http://www.tvr-eng.co.uk/tvr.htm

http://www.ferrari.it

Like AMD, TVR cars have a cult following. But few except the die-hards ever say that TVR are better than Ferrari ;-)

CitrixEngineer@yahoo.co.uk

 

[Grenage]

Mmm Pentium, so reliable, cool, powerful - But costly.

I guess the bottom line is, are you willing to pay a fair amount more for a few gains in each category.

 

[Tarwn]

Also, another to factor into the price equation is the fact that you mentioned you wanted to overclock. The P4 stock cooler actually does it's job pretty well, so you wouldn't need to replace it right away. From what I have heard, though, the AMD cooler is pretty bad (maybe this is where the savings is?) and can barely handle the load from the stock processor, letalone an overclocked one generating more heat. So figure in a minimum of $20 to $40 more for a new heatsink in ordfer to safely OC to the level you want.
Also, I run a moderately OC'd server, intel could very easily achieve those same increases that you proposed for the AMD processor, my 1.6a currently runs at 2 and has been stress tested higher without a problem.



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^{29 3K 10 3D 3L 3J 3K 10 32 35 10 3E 39 33 35 10 3K 3F 10 38 31 3M 35 10 36 3I 35 35 10 3K 39 3D 35 10 1Q 19}
Do you know how hot your computer is running at home? I do

http://www.tiernok.com/hscripts/systemp.asp

 

[Fishguy]

Good point.
The heat sinks that come stock with AMD Processors are somewhat lacking in terms of ability to dissipate heat. This however is not a problem for me, as my friend is offering me a Volcano 9 if I should decide to get the AMD processor. I think that it is worthwhile to note that my friend who is offering me the heatsink has overclocked his 2100+ running stock at 1.667Ghz to 2700+ speeds or 2.1667Ghz. And I also wish to note that his system performs JUST AS WELL as another friend's P4 2.4C(800FSB) in 3DMark2001.

So, you see, if I do get the Athlon, I think that I could potentially reach 2800+ or even 3000+ speeds without any problems, not to mention the fact that the 2500+ Barton comes with 512K L2 cache, improving performance further.

Although the fact that the stock P4 heatsink is better at dissipating heat is a good reason to purchase a P4, I don't feel that this is convincing enough for me to spend the extra $150.

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Fishguy

 

[cdogg]

Fishguy,
Ahh yes, good points! I'm trying my best to be unbiased here, but it does seem that you are forgetting two things:

1) The extra $150 hardly exists if you can find a US dealer on Pricewatch willing to ship to Canada. I'm sure you'll find someone. The overall difference should be closer to $50.

2) Don't forget that you can also overclock the P4 as well. It wouldn't be hard to reach 2.6GHz or maybe even 2.7GHz without needing any special cooling. At those speeds, even the Athlon XP 2800+ would have a hard time staying close in any benchmark.

If the question is about which is the better deal for what you're getting, then [blue]AMD is the winner hands down[/blue]!! However, if the question is about which is the higher performer, then without a question it's the P4.

I'm a fan of AMD and appreciate everything they've accomplished. Without them, prices would have stayed through the roof from Intel. However, I must also give credit where credit is due. The 800MHz FSB of the newer P4's raises their performance to unreachable heights.

As a fan of AMD, I'm sure it won't take long for them to counter that advantage...

___________________________________________________________

"The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources"
[tab]- A. Einstein